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Your opinion about Cesar Millan
I don't want to start any arguments about this but, I need your thoughts about Dog Whisperer Cesar Millan. I've heard a lot of rumors about his training techniques. Some people said he's great in training dogs. But some said he's techniques are not right.
Honestly, I am not yet watching his videos since I don't have much time to do that because of work. I just want to train my dog using the right techniques ..
I'll appreciate your thoughts. I am open for any clarifications about my question. thanks!
Honestly, I am not yet watching his videos since I don't have much time to do that because of work. I just want to train my dog using the right techniques ..
I'll appreciate your thoughts. I am open for any clarifications about my question. thanks!
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He has no qualifications to train dogs and knows nothing about their behavior or psychology. He still believes in the outdated (and disproven) theory of packs and alphas. He uses force and intimidation methods which can and will make a dog dangerous.
Find someone who uses positive reinforcement training.
Find someone who uses positive reinforcement training.
Ah there are quite a few threads on this already (here is one of them http://www.dogforum.com/dog-training-behavior/cesar-single-most-harmful-influence-dog-23417/ 
)
I used to watch and follow the show because that was all I knew. I would not recommend his show or methods. His techniques are nothing new and we have much better ways of training animals. I know he tries to make his technique sound all natural and mystical, but most of what he says is either outdated or nonsense. There are much better ways to train then his techniques.
Here are some articles on the Dog whisperer and some links to other better trainers to follow/learn from.
Dog Whisperer, Dog Psychology and Cesar Millan
Cesar Millan - The Dog Whisperer: Critics Answers
Dog Training and Behavior Advice and Information
https://wildewmn.wordpress.com/2009/08/20/the-trouble-with-gurus/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-qnqaajTk6bfs3UZuue6IQ
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/comprehensive-book-list-115977/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/web-resources-131034/
) I used to watch and follow the show because that was all I knew. I would not recommend his show or methods. His techniques are nothing new and we have much better ways of training animals. I know he tries to make his technique sound all natural and mystical, but most of what he says is either outdated or nonsense. There are much better ways to train then his techniques.
Here are some articles on the Dog whisperer and some links to other better trainers to follow/learn from.
Dog Whisperer, Dog Psychology and Cesar Millan
Cesar Millan - The Dog Whisperer: Critics Answers
Dog Training and Behavior Advice and Information
https://wildewmn.wordpress.com/2009/08/20/the-trouble-with-gurus/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-qnqaajTk6bfs3UZuue6IQ
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/comprehensive-book-list-115977/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/web-resources-131034/
I'm going to be in the minority, but I like him. I don't think he's mean or cruel. He comes from a completely different culture/background, he has a different approach, and he has saved a lot of dogs. I'm a pick-and-choose kind of girl. I pick and choose things I like from multiple trainers. Overall, I'm a positive reinforcement girl, but just like with my kids, I do believe in the use of "no" and an occasional swat to the booty. I think it's a good idea to watch multiple trainers and learn from each of them. Personally, I like Cesar Milan. I really like kikopup (I never heard of her until I was on this group) and Victoria Stillwell. Kikopup has tons of videos on youtube.
In order to know why most of us consider that he's so bad you really need to learn a little about how dogs learn, and dog body language.
Ceasar gets dog's to seemingly be cured by shutting them down, and using learned helplessness. He teaches them to suppress the way they are feeling (correcting a growl) rather then changing the way they are feeling.
Once you realize what he's doing, and if you know dog body language, you can see past the dramatic music, and the artistic editing. You begin to notice that the dog is very stressed, it's anxious, it's learned not to react, but it's not changed how it feels, and in some cases it shuts down.
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/growling-86338/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/calming-signals-10084/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/suppression-modification-shutdown-fallout-4776/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/4-quadrants-operant-conditioning-23702/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/dominance-dogs-4076/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-be...rge-dominance-aversive-training-tools-160418/
Ceasar gets dog's to seemingly be cured by shutting them down, and using learned helplessness. He teaches them to suppress the way they are feeling (correcting a growl) rather then changing the way they are feeling.
Once you realize what he's doing, and if you know dog body language, you can see past the dramatic music, and the artistic editing. You begin to notice that the dog is very stressed, it's anxious, it's learned not to react, but it's not changed how it feels, and in some cases it shuts down.
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/growling-86338/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/calming-signals-10084/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/suppression-modification-shutdown-fallout-4776/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/4-quadrants-operant-conditioning-23702/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/dominance-dogs-4076/
http://www.dogforum.com/training-be...rge-dominance-aversive-training-tools-160418/
My trainer called Cesar Milan a "clown."
Could someone actually link to an article or video of CM that demonstrates how wrong his methods are? All I've seen are his articles that come up with google searches sometimes and are filled with generic advice that avoids the question. I saw one show where he was picking out a puppy, and he ended up picking the calm. more chill puppy because he thought that puppy would be easier to train and keep focused. It sounded right to me.
Maybe I just haven't seen enough of his work.
I like kikopups in theory, as in I like her videos, but then when I try those methods on my dog for some reason they backfire. For example, her "teaching calmness" video. She went through these methods of being a magnet and rewarding your dog with food when you catch him being calm. She did talk about methods to avoid arousing your dog, but if my dog is chilling out next to me, if I give him food he gets super excited and stops being calm. Finally I learned the best way to teach calmness is to just chill and ignore him when he's cuddling next to me. He enjoys that in itself. The second I give him a treat he perks up.
And even though I do believe in compassionate training, kikopup's assertion that yelling or snapping at your dog is being abusive is a little bit of a reach. I'm pretty patient with my dog, but occasionally I have lost my temper and snapped at him, just like I very occasionally do with the humans in my life. I don't use it as a training method, and I usually feel bad afterwards and apologize (which my dog seems to get lol) but I don't feel like I've been abusive.
Could someone actually link to an article or video of CM that demonstrates how wrong his methods are? All I've seen are his articles that come up with google searches sometimes and are filled with generic advice that avoids the question. I saw one show where he was picking out a puppy, and he ended up picking the calm. more chill puppy because he thought that puppy would be easier to train and keep focused. It sounded right to me.
Maybe I just haven't seen enough of his work.
I like kikopups in theory, as in I like her videos, but then when I try those methods on my dog for some reason they backfire. For example, her "teaching calmness" video. She went through these methods of being a magnet and rewarding your dog with food when you catch him being calm. She did talk about methods to avoid arousing your dog, but if my dog is chilling out next to me, if I give him food he gets super excited and stops being calm. Finally I learned the best way to teach calmness is to just chill and ignore him when he's cuddling next to me. He enjoys that in itself. The second I give him a treat he perks up.
And even though I do believe in compassionate training, kikopup's assertion that yelling or snapping at your dog is being abusive is a little bit of a reach. I'm pretty patient with my dog, but occasionally I have lost my temper and snapped at him, just like I very occasionally do with the humans in my life. I don't use it as a training method, and I usually feel bad afterwards and apologize (which my dog seems to get lol) but I don't feel like I've been abusive.
The Dog Whisperer - Cesar's Worst Bite(Cesar gets bitten by a Labrador!!!) - Video DailymotionMy trainer called Cesar Milan a "clown."
Could someone actually link to an article or video of CM that demonstrates how wrong his methods are? All I've seen are his articles that come up with google searches sometimes and are filled with generic advice that avoids the question. I saw one show where he was picking out a puppy, and he ended up picking the calm. more chill puppy because he thought that puppy would be easier to train and keep focused. It sounded right to me.
Maybe I just haven't seen enough of his work.
I like kikopups in theory, as in I like her videos, but then when I try those methods on my dog for some reason they backfire. For example, her "teaching calmness" video. She went through these methods of being a magnet and rewarding your dog with food when you catch him being calm. She did talk about methods to avoid arousing your dog, but if my dog is chilling out next to me, if I give him food he gets super excited and stops being calm. Finally I learned the best way to teach calmness is to just chill and ignore him when he's cuddling next to me. He enjoys that in itself. The second I give him a treat he perks up.
And even though I do believe in compassionate training, kikopup's assertion that yelling or snapping at your dog is being abusive is a little bit of a reach. I'm pretty patient with my dog, but occasionally I have lost my temper and snapped at him, just like I very occasionally do with the humans in my life. I don't use it as a training method, and I usually feel bad afterwards and apologize (which my dog seems to get lol) but I don't feel like I've been abusive.
That is how he handled resource guarding food, and is a text book example of how to push a dog that does not want to bite way over the edge, and of the worse way to handle resource guarding. It is also a great way to study dog body language, look for whale eyes, looking away, tensing up, lip lifting, tongue flicking, avoidance, etc.
Pretty much every modern dog trainer thinks he's a terrible dog trainer. His methods are dangerous for a person used to being around dogs, and VERY dangerous for those who aren't used to them.
That's actually not true. Quite a few dogs that he's "rehabilitated" have been euthanized. All you have to do is google it.I'm going to be in the minority, but I like him. I don't think he's mean or cruel. He comes from a completely different culture/background, he has a different approach, and he has saved a lot of dogs. I'm a pick-and-choose kind of girl. I pick and choose things I like from multiple trainers. Overall, I'm a positive reinforcement girl, but just like with my kids, I do believe in the use of "no" and an occasional swat to the booty. I think it's a good idea to watch multiple trainers and learn from each of them. Personally, I like Cesar Milan. I really like kikopup (I never heard of her until I was on this group) and Victoria Stillwell. Kikopup has tons of videos on youtube.
Dogs don't understand no and they definitely don't understand being hit. When you yell and/or hit a dog all they learn is to fear you. They don't associate that sort of punishment with whatever they are doing wrong.
Cesar Millan has no idea what he is doing and his methods are detrimental to dogs.
The Dog Whisperer - Cesar's Worst Bite(Cesar gets bitten by a Labrador!!!) - Video Dailymotion
That is how he handled resource guarding food, and is a text book example of how to push a dog that does not want to bite way over the edge, and of the worse way to handle resource guarding. It is also a great way to study dog body language, look for whale eyes, looking away, tensing up, lip lifting, tongue flicking, avoidance, etc.
at 6:36 I literally gasped when I saw him slap the dog on the side of the neck. OMG. Now my dog is my first dog but even someone who's never been around dogs before should have the common sense to know this is a stupid thing to do. Just, stupid, stupid, stupid. This is way worse than I imagined. For god's sake, he didn't even remember the gender of the dog - he keeps referring to her as "he." Thank you for this clip.
I think he started out ok, but slowly became worse. I don't disagree with everything, some of his stuff is common sense and actually works.
I do think he's gone to some gimmicks and shortcuts that don't actually work. And is definitely much more harsh than ever needed at times.
IMO, he does have a talent with dogs, but he doesn't use it right and for the sake of tv and fame has altered his methods in a negative way.
I do think he's gone to some gimmicks and shortcuts that don't actually work. And is definitely much more harsh than ever needed at times.
IMO, he does have a talent with dogs, but he doesn't use it right and for the sake of tv and fame has altered his methods in a negative way.
I agree 100%. Punishment works with human children because you can explain both the offense and the resulting consequence. With dogs you can't - you have to get the timing perfectly precise and even then there's a good chance of it backfiring. It's really not worth it.That's actually not true. Quite a few dogs that he's "rehabilitated" have been euthanized. All you have to do is google it.I'm going to be in the minority, but I like him. I don't think he's mean or cruel. He comes from a completely different culture/background, he has a different approach, and he has saved a lot of dogs. I'm a pick-and-choose kind of girl. I pick and choose things I like from multiple trainers. Overall, I'm a positive reinforcement girl, but just like with my kids, I do believe in the use of "no" and an occasional swat to the booty. I think it's a good idea to watch multiple trainers and learn from each of them. Personally, I like Cesar Milan. I really like kikopup (I never heard of her until I was on this group) and Victoria Stillwell. Kikopup has tons of videos on youtube.
Dogs don't understand no and they definitely don't understand being hit. When you yell and/or hit a dog all they learn is to fear you. They don't associate that sort of punishment with whatever they are doing wrong.
Cesar Millan has no idea what he is doing and his methods are detrimental to dogs.
To me, Cesar is like the Kardashians - great at marketing himself but not much real talent at the core. I think his methods are more than outdated - they're foolish.
I'm still watching the video @Rain linked.
lol at 16:03 "In the weeks following Cesar's visit, Holly's aggression worsens."
lol um YEAH.
lol at 16:03 "In the weeks following Cesar's visit, Holly's aggression worsens."
lol um YEAH.
I'm still watching the video @Rain linked.
lol at 16:03 "In the weeks following Cesar's visit, Holly's aggression worsens."
lol um YEAH.
That episode pretty much finished him for me. In the past, before I knew better, I used to follow him and be amazed at how he "cured" the dogs. Now when I watch reruns of the show I'm heartbroken for the dogs.
Watching this video, I'm genuinely amazed at his thinking and how the dog's owners are just going along with it - even after Holly bit him.
To me, it's pretty obvious you never "test" a dog "just to see what will happen." Once a dog's been given the opportunity to bite, the likelihood that she will bite again is higher, not lower. He should have carefully managed the situation to prevent that from happening.
I would have started with just throwing treats at her or into her bowl while she was eating. Each week, I'd come a little closer to her when I throw the treats. I would try different hand movements ie slow, sudden, etc. I'd just keep conditioning her to the idea that me coming toward her food is a good idea and has great results. This is basically what i had to do to condition my puppy Dorje to my sharp collar grabs. Now when I make a sudden movement toward my dog, instead of running away, he runs toward me and we crash into each other and have some good fun.
This video is genuinely upsetting me.
I can see no logic at all between his stupid aggression posturing.
To me, it's pretty obvious you never "test" a dog "just to see what will happen." Once a dog's been given the opportunity to bite, the likelihood that she will bite again is higher, not lower. He should have carefully managed the situation to prevent that from happening.
I would have started with just throwing treats at her or into her bowl while she was eating. Each week, I'd come a little closer to her when I throw the treats. I would try different hand movements ie slow, sudden, etc. I'd just keep conditioning her to the idea that me coming toward her food is a good idea and has great results. This is basically what i had to do to condition my puppy Dorje to my sharp collar grabs. Now when I make a sudden movement toward my dog, instead of running away, he runs toward me and we crash into each other and have some good fun.
This video is genuinely upsetting me.
I can see no logic at all between his stupid aggression posturing.
If Holly isn't enough of a reason to not like him, there's Shadow the Husky whom he repeatedly chokes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_W5i5RmDb8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kn5RdZs7Aw
A CESAR MILAN STORY - MyCorgi.com
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...adow-and-cesar-millan-update-the-strung-husky
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_W5i5RmDb8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kn5RdZs7Aw
A CESAR MILAN STORY - MyCorgi.com
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...adow-and-cesar-millan-update-the-strung-husky
The way he talks about alpha and dominance you'd think dogs are trying to take over the world. Everything is the dogs trying to be alpha and show you who is boss. It's a joke. I've only seen a few episodes, I can't watch him and don't want to give his show more views. I remember one show where there was a dog afraid of a particular breed and he forced the dog onto it's side and had a bunch of that breed come in and walk up to the dog. I felt sick watching this poor dog struggle and then finally give up. Dogs aren't people, you can just say 'you'll be ok. They won't hurt you.' I'm sure this dog was fearing for it's life. It's been many years since I've seen this episode, so I could be getting some of this wrong. He pushes dogs until they break.
His training is based on the alpha/pack which is a theory that has been proven wrong. There are a bunch of resources in this link if you want to read up on it.
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/dominance-dogs-4076/
I use to follow dominance training, it's all I knew. I trained my two boys with it and wish I could go back in time and train them with positive reinforcement. I did use some positive training, but it wasn't as common and the training books I had were older. Now my dane I've used positive training, the difference is amazing. She is learning better and faster. She listens better and looks forward to training. She shows less appeasement signals, even though I've given up the dom. training all together my boys still give them. It makes me feel really bad.
His training is based on the alpha/pack which is a theory that has been proven wrong. There are a bunch of resources in this link if you want to read up on it.
http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/dominance-dogs-4076/
I use to follow dominance training, it's all I knew. I trained my two boys with it and wish I could go back in time and train them with positive reinforcement. I did use some positive training, but it wasn't as common and the training books I had were older. Now my dane I've used positive training, the difference is amazing. She is learning better and faster. She listens better and looks forward to training. She shows less appeasement signals, even though I've given up the dom. training all together my boys still give them. It makes me feel really bad.
One thing I've noticed with these comments is that people here seem to think that we need to be gentler with dogs than with kids?
That's not right. Seems to me like you treat them pretty much the same. Choices have immediate consequence. Encourage choice making, and reward and reinforce good choices. Assume complete innocence, and be aware that there isn't any sort of malicious intent behind bad behavior. Realize that they are completely in the moment, and are impulsive. etc.
Also, one more question: My 11 month puppy Dorje and I have a five minute cuddle session each morning. He jumps next to me and rolls onto his back and wiggles like crazy. When he calms down, I give him a good solid petting, from his ears to his chest and his tummy. Sometimes I straddle him/get on top (without my body touching him). Is that an alpha roll, and do you guys think any damage will come of it? He seems to like it, and is always very relaxed when i do this. I'm not trying to dominate him, but I am on top of him while he's on his back, so I'm not sure.
That's not right. Seems to me like you treat them pretty much the same. Choices have immediate consequence. Encourage choice making, and reward and reinforce good choices. Assume complete innocence, and be aware that there isn't any sort of malicious intent behind bad behavior. Realize that they are completely in the moment, and are impulsive. etc.
Also, one more question: My 11 month puppy Dorje and I have a five minute cuddle session each morning. He jumps next to me and rolls onto his back and wiggles like crazy. When he calms down, I give him a good solid petting, from his ears to his chest and his tummy. Sometimes I straddle him/get on top (without my body touching him). Is that an alpha roll, and do you guys think any damage will come of it? He seems to like it, and is always very relaxed when i do this. I'm not trying to dominate him, but I am on top of him while he's on his back, so I'm not sure.
Augusta,
This is a video that I find particularly disturbing as it's such a classic case of learned helplessness.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5DxPhs23l4
Positive reinforcement training doesn't mean "permissive" training. Of course, it means having expectations and setting limits for one's dog. I think that's a common misperception.
This is a video that I find particularly disturbing as it's such a classic case of learned helplessness.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5DxPhs23l4
Positive reinforcement training doesn't mean "permissive" training. Of course, it means having expectations and setting limits for one's dog. I think that's a common misperception.
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