Dog Forum banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
This will be my first dog, although my family has had dogs ever since I was born, and I do most of the work/training/medical care, etc.. I'm looking for a dog that will be good with my 2 friendly dogs now, but it's not important that it's friendly to strange dogs. I also camp, a lot. For weeks at a time in my camper, and I want a dog that I can take on long hikes with me, and that (ideally)could be off-leash. This isn't super important, though, being as I have a beagle who can hardly ever be off leash. I want an intelligent, easy to train breed. I would also like a good watch dog (not necessarily a guard dog, though) because I do go camping often by myself. I would prefer the dog to be at least medium in size, and as few grooming needs as possible. Thank you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
Right then, let's break this LONG list of requirements into it's components:

1) Good with existing dogs (ie. social) but then immediately say you say it doesn't matter if it's good with other dogs.
2) Will take long hikes.. (ie. active and energetic)
3) Will live in a camper (i.e. no fixed territory or a very large territory)
4) Will walk effortlessly (my paraphrase) off leash
5) Intelligent
6) Easy to train (not the same as #5)
7) Protective but only when necessary
8) Medium size
9) Easy maintenance.

So let me reword what you're asking for. You want a medium size dog that comes well trained and well socialized out of the box that can handle a semi-nomadic outdoor life style, protect you when it's necessary but be passive/submissive at all other times and be obedient and easy to care for with minimal effort.

Such a dog does not exist. You can TRAIN virtually any dog to be like that. However, your demands are all on the dog and not on yourself so you will fail to achieve this result with any dog on the planet. Full stop.

You are setting the bar for the dog WAY too high and for yourself WAY too low. Nobody can make a recommendation to you because your expectations are utterly unrealistic.

Before anyone can help you, you need to go back to the list above and define what YOU are willing to put in to achieving that result first.

In fact, I CAN think of two breeds that fit your description out of the box: coyotes and wolves. The only issue here is that they don't need an owner.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Right then, let's break this LONG list of requirements into it's components:

1) Good with existing dogs (ie. social) but then immediately say you say it doesn't matter if it's good with other dogs.
2) Will take long hikes.. (ie. active and energetic)
3) Will live in a camper (i.e. no fixed territory or a very large territory)
4) Will walk effortlessly (my paraphrase) off leash
5) Intelligent
6) Easy to train (not the same as #5)
7) Protective but only when necessary
8) Medium size
9) Easy maintenance.

So let me reword what you're asking for. You want a medium size dog that comes well trained and well socialized out of the box that can handle a semi-nomadic outdoor life style, protect you when it's necessary but be passive/submissive at all other times and be obedient and easy to care for with minimal effort.

Such a dog does not exist. You can TRAIN virtually any dog to be like that. However, your demands are all on the dog and not on yourself so you will fail to achieve this result with any dog on the planet. Full stop.

You are setting the bar for the dog WAY too high and for yourself WAY too low. Nobody can make a recommendation to you because your expectations are utterly unrealistic.

Before anyone can help you, you need to go back to the list above and define what YOU are willing to put in to achieving that result first.

In fact, I CAN think of two breeds that fit your description out of the box: coyotes and wolves. The only issue here is that they don't need an owner.
I'm not wanting a dog that comes out of the box like this. I am looking for breeds that have these, or similar characteristics. I need a dog that will get along with dogs it is raised with, but I don't need it to get along with other dogs once it's older. A good example would be the akita. They are great with dogs that they live with, but are more aloof with strange dogs. I don't NEED them to be aloof around strange dogs, that's not really an important factor for me is all I'm saying. And I dont want the dog to protect me. Like I said, I want a watch dog, not a guard dog. A dog that will bark/point out potential "threats". The 2 dogs I have now view everybody as a friend and so they don't bark or hardly react at all when someone or something approaches. And I do need an active dog. I only sleep in the camper, from around 9pm to 6am. Then, I am outside, all day, every day. It will not be "confined" to the camper at all. Weather doesn't deter me, so I'm outside in the rain, snow, what have you. Sorry if I made anything confusing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
I remain by my opinion that the majority of the effort needed in order to mold an animal to suit your list of requirements will fall on you, not on the "breed" of the dog. With all said and done, if you do not address your own role in training a dog to suit this list of requirements then you will be disappointed with ANY and EVERY dog.

That said, there are some broad generalities that can be stated:

- Mastiffs and related breeds are GENERALLY inclined to bond closely with their owners. They are loyal, affectionate, and relatively easy to train (albeit sometimes a little head strong). Many, however, are quite large (and some drool a lot, which would be a non-starter for me). They will get along well with your existing dogs IN GENERAL once socialized (this is on YOU, not on the dog) and they make glorious companions for someone who spends a lot of time outdoors. They have been bread to protect cattle and can become intensely aggressive of "intruders" to the point of killing them. Some Cane Corso's, for example, have been known to kill humans. Most have not but would likely lay down their lives to protect YOU from something like a bear if push came to shove. This can make them "good" dogs for someone who spends a lot of time in the bush or "tricky" dogs for someone who spends a lot of time in the bush. The difference will be how much effort you put into training them.

- As for walking off a leash and staying close in open spaces. If this is your biggest priority then you would look for a dog with a strong herding instinct. Some of these breeds have it in the name but some do not. Poodles, for example, have a tremendous herding instinct and actually make really good herding dogs. A poodle will seldom let you out of its sight when you're outside, which makes it a dog that won't get lost in a forest. I'm sure that most "herding" dogs will display similar behaviour. I actually have a poodle and it matches several of your demands. Intelligent, easy to train, protective only when necessary, tolerant of other dogs (if you put the effort into socialization), active, athletic, curious (tolerant of a changing territory) and incredibly easy to walk with off-leash. Where you would need to learn a new skill is in the grooming of a poodle. Their hair doesn't fall out so you would need to clip it (of have it clipped) every 6 weeks or so.

So to summarize, I would think you're looking for a small(ish) mastiff or a herding dog to cover most of your bases. I will repeat again what I said above, which is that YOU are the biggest variable in getting the dog you want, not the dog.

good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
60 Posts
I’m not sure I”m on the same page. If you have two dogs how would this be your first dog?

I speak from experience that as long as you are active an Australian Cattle Dog meets a lot of what you are looking for. They are smart, easily trained, get along with family bonding super close to one or two, and need lots of activity/work. Mine gets along with my other dog and will bark when someone comes to door. I do not have to worry about him running away off leash. I can’t stress enough that they are as full of energy as they are of love.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
Actually English Bulldogs are the best
I definitely don’t agree. Just because of their bad health and bad exterior I wouldn’t recommend anyone to get one. But apart from that the English bulldog is nothing like what OP asked for. She wants a dog that she can take on long hikes that’s intelligent and easy to train. The English Bulldog doesn’t meet any of those requirements.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
Right then, let's break this LONG list of requirements into it's components:

1) Good with existing dogs (ie. social) but then immediately say you say it doesn't matter if it's good with other dogs.
2) Will take long hikes.. (ie. active and energetic)
3) Will live in a camper (i.e. no fixed territory or a very large territory)
4) Will walk effortlessly (my paraphrase) off leash
5) Intelligent
6) Easy to train (not the same as #5)
7) Protective but only when necessary
8) Medium size
9) Easy maintenance.

So let me reword what you're asking for. You want a medium size dog that comes well trained and well socialized out of the box that can handle a semi-nomadic outdoor life style, protect you when it's necessary but be passive/submissive at all other times and be obedient and easy to care for with minimal effort.

Such a dog does not exist. You can TRAIN virtually any dog to be like that. However, your demands are all on the dog and not on yourself so you will fail to achieve this result with any dog on the planet. Full stop.

You are setting the bar for the dog WAY too high and for yourself WAY too low. Nobody can make a recommendation to you because your expectations are utterly unrealistic.

Before anyone can help you, you need to go back to the list above and define what YOU are willing to put in to achieving that result first.

In fact, I CAN think of two breeds that fit your description out of the box: coyotes and wolves. The only issue here is that they don't need an owner.
I really don’t understand this. She’s asking for a breed that generally is dog friendly, have will to please, is likely to teach to walk of leash (low prey drive), would love the outdoors and long hikes, preferably medium sized. What’s the problem? That’s great information and as she mentioned she’s looking for these characteristics in breeds, she’s not expecting the dog to be born like this.

The owner have a big part in how the dog will behave but you can’t deny that dogs are bred for different purposes. A dog isnt what you make it. Different breeds have different possibilities.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
I really don’t understand this. She’s asking for a breed that generally is dog friendly, have will to please, is likely to teach to walk of leash (low prey drive), would love the outdoors and long hikes, preferably medium sized. What’s the problem? That’s great information and as she mentioned she’s looking for these characteristics in breeds, she’s not expecting the dog to be born like this.

The owner have a big part in how the dog will behave but you can’t deny that dogs are bred for different purposes. A dog isnt what you make it. Different breeds have different possibilities.
I think we established above that the OP wasn't looking for an "out of the box" dog that would meet his/her requirements. That was my initial impression but the OP corrected me above. The point I initially wanted to make, perhaps clumsily, is that the breed is only one aspect of the equation. How the dog is raised and trained is equally (if not more) important. I think the OP understood that point.

As noted above, I did give my thoughts about which breeds the OP might find interesting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
The point I initially wanted to make, perhaps clumsily, is that the breed is only one aspect of the equation. How the dog is raised and trained is equally (if not more) important. I think the OP understood that point.
I remain by my opinion that the majority of the effort needed in order to mold an animal to suit your list of requirements will fall on you, not on the "breed" of the dog.
Well it’s this part I disagree with. I often hear that a dog will become what you make it, and that’s a very wrong and dangerous statement. Some dogs have different abilities and instincts that will either suit us or not. So it’s perfectly normal to be stating these requirements and wishes from a breed. For instance if it’s important for you to have a dog that can be off leash you shouldn’t get a whippet. Anyhow that doesn’t mean that the dog will be good of leash just because it’s a certain breed but you have different starting points with different breeds. You can’t take a Greyhound and a Pug and say that their instincts to a moving object mostly depends on you as an owner. That is to disrespect the breeds and their differences.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
The first breed I thought of on top of my head were Kromfohrlander. It’s a small-medium sized dog who comes in two different coat types and neither of them requires much grooming. They’re suppose to have very low hunting instinct even though they’re bred from terriers. It’s a breed that is often very attached to its owner, a one person dog. Is typically reserved to strangers and is known to alert/guard to its owner.
The questionable part is their heritage to terriers. Which means that they might have some lasting prey drive and might not have very much will to please. Anyhow they’re bred to have a low prey drive and to be easy to train. It’s also important to be careful when choosing breeder since they’ve had some problems with bad mentality, insecurity etc. So, as with any breed, finding a good breeder and good dogs is vital.

If the guarding part isn’t as important I would recommend to also look into retrievers and spaniels.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
Well it’s this part I disagree with. I often hear that a dog will become what you make it, and that’s a very wrong and dangerous statement. Some dogs have different abilities and instincts that will either suit us or not. So it’s perfectly normal to be stating these requirements and wishes from a breed. For instance if it’s important for you to have a dog that can be off leash you shouldn’t get a whippet. Anyhow that doesn’t mean that the dog will be good of leash just because it’s a certain breed but you have different starting points with different breeds. You can’t take a Greyhound and a Pug and say that their instincts to a moving object mostly depends on you as an owner. That is to disrespect the breeds and their differences.
I see. This is ye olde nature/nurture argument that psychologists have been arguing about since the dawn of psychology. It would appear that you think a dog's behaviour is mostly a result of it's nature (breed) and I believe that with proper training (nurture) a lot can be achieved. The truth, of course will be somewhere in the middle.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
I see. This is ye olde nature/nurture argument that psychologists have been arguing about since the dawn of psychology. It would appear that you think a dog's behaviour is mostly a result of it's nature (breed) and I believe that with proper training (nurture) a lot can be achieved. The truth, of course will be somewhere in the middle.
Well you can’t compare humans and dogs like that. We don’t have different breeds in the human race. While different dog breeds have been bred for centuries to achieve specific abilities and characteristics. Hence you can amlost always guarantee that a Border Collie wants to herd, that a Coonhound wants to hunt, that a Siberian husky wants to pull and so on. Of course the training of a dog have an enormous impact, but we need to take the dogs heritage and traits in account, everything else would be unfair to the dog.
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top