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I know there are some conflicting theories about whether to take your dog to the dog park and what age they should be introduced, but I really think this park I found is a perfect environment to keep my pup exercised and socially exposed while she is developing habits and still impressionable.

I have a 6 month cattle dog/husky/aussie/staffy/(50% unknown) mix. she is very playful and independent and probably overconfident. with people, we have been setting strong rules and she is mostly compliant and on her best behavior. and on our regular walks, she is getting good at maintaining focus on me and generally ignores other dogs and people unless I greet them.

but at the dog park she lets her personality show. and she is a brat. her pass time is to antagonize the other dogs in very subtle and not so subtle ways. when a toy is introduced she inevitably follows the dog with the toy until they drop it at their owners' feet or sit down with it. then she leans in next to the tensed up and often growling dog and slowly plucks the toy from under their chin. very bold and very rude. a few dogs will lash out and tell her to stop but most avoid conflict and ultimately give in. Not very of my pup but not the worst thing I suppose.

the worst is when she antagonizes other dogs to fight each other. whenever two dogs at play start to get overexcited my pup will run over and involve herself by hovering around the playing dogs and lunging in and barking/air nipping/nipping the dog which is losing the play fight. often this can trigger the dog she targets to become overwhelmed and defensive and ultimately lash out and fight its original play partner.

I've seen it enough to recognize the signs and call my dog away before she can instigate the other dogs to fight but I still want to understand the root cause of this behavior and how I might encourage better dog manners.

yesterday I was really upset with my pup. I've started watching her closely and deciphering her language meticulously. A new couple brought their 4-month-old sibling pit mixes to the park for the first time and 10 minutes later one of them "attacked" my dog lunging snarling and biting until I pulled my dog away. I felt so bad for the couple seeing this ugly behavior from their pup and the impact it would have on their pup. They thought it was all their fault but I knew my dog had really caused the altercation.

For a while, I had watched her subtly playing a possession game where she would routinely squeeze herself in between the other puppies and their owners. all the while they were wrestling and playing but it was clear that my dog was also showing she could clam their owners if she wanted. I watched the two puppies become more agitated as the play went on but I thought perhaps my dog was just coaxing a more competitive spirit out of them since she wasn't actually being rough with her play. then my dog went too far. one of the new pups wanted some reassurance from its owners and my dog promptly cut her off and pushed her away. the other puppy was very upset by this and attacked.

my puppy is so rude and antagonistic to other dogs. very subtly. just enough so that nobody else thinks she is being a bully but I know it. what do I do?
 

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You are right to notice this, it's also important to be aware of her age - she is coming out of puppy hood and entering adolescence.

It is really bad manners, it is very unfair on the other dogs and also there may be a time when she picks on the wrong dog and the retaliation could be serious.

And, the more she practises this, the more adept she will become.

So, the only thing I can think of is to not let her do it. I'd stop going to the dog park, I don't personally think they are good environments for dogs anyway - too much, too many, too enclosed.

I don't want my dog to be focused on other dogs or for them to teach mine social interactions; I want me to be his focus and teacher.

There is a good video I will try to find and link.
 

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You are right to notice this, it's also important to be aware of her age - she is coming out of puppy hood and entering adolescence.

It is really bad manners, it is very unfair on the other dogs and also there may be a time when she picks on the wrong dog and the retaliation could be serious.

And, the more she practises this, the more adept she will become.

So, the only thing I can think of is to not let her do it. I'd stop going to the dog park, I don't personally think they are good environments for dogs anyway - too much, too many, too enclosed.

I don't want my dog to be focused on other dogs or for them to teach mine social interactions; I want me to be his focus and teacher.

There is a good video I will try to find and link.
Normally I would agree. But I would add the caveat that this isn't really the standard dog park I was used to. I was amazed when I found it. its a large several acre park in the middle of a nice neighborhood with no fences and a regular roster of dogs that come each day from the neighborhood. it's less of a dog park and more of a daily informal play date. I have found it very helpful in working on recall and greeting behavior with people. and most of the time my pup is a great playmate and has a handful of friends who love to wrestle with her. I can only afford to give her a couple of 2 mile walks a day and that's not nearly enough. the park seems to be an essential outlet for her energy while she develops good indoor manners at home. bottom line I am beginning to question whether the dog park is best for her.

But on the other side, i think it could be the only place where she can learn the manners she needs. I would love for a dog to tackler her and chase her off. I cant teach her those manners and if I take her away now then they'll just remain her default I fear.

the other thing is that she seems to thrive in really rough play. she may be rude to other dogs but is totally prepared to be ganged up on and roughly wrestled pinned and nipped. even while she was antagonizing those pups she spends most of her time on her back. I sometimes wonder if she is frustrated that nobody will play rough with her and so tries to create a playmate artificially by pissing them off. as soon as another dog snaps at her she seems delighted and starts bowing and bouncing around ready to play.
 

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I just realised it was you who I replied to in that thread 2 months ago.

I take it you didnt like or follow the advice then, sorry to disappoint you but it hasn't changed now.
 

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I just realised it was you who I replied to in that thread 2 months ago.

I take it you didnt like or follow the advice then, sorry to disappoint you but it hasn't changed now.
yeah. we did see an improvement in the rough play though. she no longer antagonizes other dogs physically. now its mind games and social cues. do you think there's any chance she will outgrow this new behavior too?
 

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Not if you keep letting her practise it. It simply isn't fair to expect other dogs to ”tackle her” - that relies on her bullying them first, so (a) you are setting her up for failure, not success, and (b) you are allowing other dogs to be her victims, possibly a number of them until she meets the one that does ”tackle her”. It is your job to teach her manners, you can do it - by not allowing her to engage in thuggish bullying.
 

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Not if you keep letting her practise it. It simply isn't fair to expect other dogs to ”tackle her” - that relies on her bullying them first, so (a) you are setting her ip for failure, not a sucess, and (b) you are allowing other dogs to be her victims, possibly a number of them until she meets the one that does ”tackle her”. It is your job to teach her manners, you can do it - by not allowing her to engage in thuggish bullying.
ok so then the next time I'm at the park and I see this behavior: I call her away and praise her for listening. then what? It doesn't come across over text so let me be clear that I'm not being facetious. if I give her a time out or leave the park then she won't want to listen to me in the future. if I let her go then she will return to what she was doing. and if I don't call her and just approach her and physically remove her then it might make her want to run away from me and really be a setback in obedience. whats the best way to teach her not to repeat the rude behavior?

so far my solution was to let the other dogs teach her if it looked like they might. but I agree that is really unfair so a reliable alternative is very welcome.
 

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I really, really wouldn't take her to the dog park at all.

If you absolutely must, I would not let her engage with other dogs. Any. At all. I would work on her focus being on me, and me alone.

Dogs do not have to be BFFs with other dogs, being dog neutral is a far more natural state for them - if you look at packs of wild or feral dogs, they bumble along largely ignoring each other except when engaged in particular activities like hunting or mating.

Expecting her to play with other dogs would be like expecting you to have a deep, personal and meaningful conversation with every person you cross paths with - not natural and not appropriate.
 

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I do want to be clear that I follow my dog and keep a very close eye on her behavior. I frequently call her away from situations where I think she is taking advantage of a more submissive dog. so far I have been tolerant of her rude behavior only when the other dog seems confident and capable of reprimanding her.
 

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I really, really wouldn't take her to the dog park at all.

If you absolutely must, I would not let her engage with other dogs. Any. At all. I would work on her focus being on me, and me alone.

Dogs do not have to be BFFs with other dogs, being dog neutral is a far more natural state for them - if you look at packs of wild or feral dogs, they bumble along largely ignoring each other except when engaged in particular activities like hunting or mating.

Expecting her to play with other dogs would be like expecting you to have a deep, personal and meaningful conversation with every person you cross paths with - not natural and not appropriate.
she is that way for the most part. she has a few BFFs and ignores the rest. the issues are usually with new and high energy dogs that everyone swarms to interact with. other than that the cast of dogs is usually the same.
 

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Ive got a cattle/malamute/border who started alot of fights at our dog park. We only walk through there now when no other dogs are there. It sounds like it might start to become too dangerous as your dog matures. Unfortunately the reality is most dogs dont do well in dog parks
 

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I know there are some conflicting theories about whether to take your dog to the dog park and what age they should be introduced, but I really think this park I found is a perfect environment to keep my pup exercised and socially exposed while she is developing habits and still impressionable.

I have a 6 month cattle dog/husky/aussie/staffy/(50% unknown) mix. she is very playful and independent and probably overconfident. with people, we have been setting strong rules and she is mostly compliant and on her best behavior. and on our regular walks, she is getting good at maintaining focus on me and generally ignores other dogs and people unless I greet them.

but at the dog park she lets her personality show. and she is a brat. her pass time is to antagonize the other dogs in very subtle and not so subtle ways. when a toy is introduced she inevitably follows the dog with the toy until they drop it at their owners' feet or sit down with it. then she leans in next to the tensed up and often growling dog and slowly plucks the toy from under their chin. very bold and very rude. a few dogs will lash out and tell her to stop but most avoid conflict and ultimately give in. Not very of my pup but not the worst thing I suppose.

the worst is when she antagonizes other dogs to fight each other. whenever two dogs at play start to get overexcited my pup will run over and involve herself by hovering around the playing dogs and lunging in and barking/air nipping/nipping the dog which is losing the play fight. often this can trigger the dog she targets to become overwhelmed and defensive and ultimately lash out and fight its original play partner.

I've seen it enough to recognize the signs and call my dog away before she can instigate the other dogs to fight but I still want to understand the root cause of this behavior and how I might encourage better dog manners.

yesterday I was really upset with my pup. I've started watching her closely and deciphering her language meticulously. A new couple brought their 4-month-old sibling pit mixes to the park for the first time and 10 minutes later one of them "attacked" my dog lunging snarling and biting until I pulled my dog away. I felt so bad for the couple seeing this ugly behavior from their pup and the impact it would have on their pup. They thought it was all their fault but I knew my dog had really caused the altercation.

For a while, I had watched her subtly playing a possession game where she would routinely squeeze herself in between the other puppies and their owners. all the while they were wrestling and playing but it was clear that my dog was also showing she could clam their owners if she wanted. I watched the two puppies become more agitated as the play went on but I thought perhaps my dog was just coaxing a more competitive spirit out of them since she wasn't actually being rough with her play. then my dog went too far. one of the new pups wanted some reassurance from its owners and my dog promptly cut her off and pushed her away. the other puppy was very upset by this and attacked.

my puppy is so rude and antagonistic to other dogs. very subtly. just enough so that nobody else thinks she is being a bully but I know it. what do I do?
It is sad and unfortunate that your dog behaves this way. I have been going to Dogpark’s for almost two decades now. I have seen the best and worst of behaviors in dogs. I have either been extremely lucky or smart in the way my dogs behave at park. They are hardly outta my sight or our RANGE LIMIT. They will stay within the 50 ft in front or back of me always. Most of the time they are in front. I walk with a 6 ft walking stick. It’s for two purpose. You can figure that out. I can tell you this. If your dog does not get the training it needs so badly. It will end up hurting someone or get hurt it’s self. May I suggest a doggie daycare facility? It has worked wonders for dogs in my area. The people there let your dog play and correct it constantly when not behaving. The dog must pass their introduction test though at any good facility. I wish you luck with your dog. Hang in there.
 

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I came across this, which you might find interesting.


I'm not sure doggy daycare would be a good move, I'd be concerned the environment would be even more arousing.
 

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I know there are some conflicting theories about whether to take your dog to the dog park and what age they should be introduced, but I really think this park I found is a perfect environment to keep my pup exercised and socially exposed while she is developing habits and still impressionable.

I have a 6 month cattle dog/husky/aussie/staffy/(50% unknown) mix. she is very playful and independent and probably overconfident. with people, we have been setting strong rules and she is mostly compliant and on her best behavior. and on our regular walks, she is getting good at maintaining focus on me and generally ignores other dogs and people unless I greet them.

but at the dog park she lets her personality show. and she is a brat. her pass time is to antagonize the other dogs in very subtle and not so subtle ways. when a toy is introduced she inevitably follows the dog with the toy until they drop it at their owners' feet or sit down with it. then she leans in next to the tensed up and often growling dog and slowly plucks the toy from under their chin. very bold and very rude. a few dogs will lash out and tell her to stop but most avoid conflict and ultimately give in. Not very of my pup but not the worst thing I suppose.

the worst is when she antagonizes other dogs to fight each other. whenever two dogs at play start to get overexcited my pup will run over and involve herself by hovering around the playing dogs and lunging in and barking/air nipping/nipping the dog which is losing the play fight. often this can trigger the dog she targets to become overwhelmed and defensive and ultimately lash out and fight its original play partner.

I've seen it enough to recognize the signs and call my dog away before she can instigate the other dogs to fight but I still want to understand the root cause of this behavior and how I might encourage better dog manners.

yesterday I was really upset with my pup. I've started watching her closely and deciphering her language meticulously. A new couple brought their 4-month-old sibling pit mixes to the park for the first time and 10 minutes later one of them "attacked" my dog lunging snarling and biting until I pulled my dog away. I felt so bad for the couple seeing this ugly behavior from their pup and the impact it would have on their pup. They thought it was all their fault but I knew my dog had really caused the altercation.

For a while, I had watched her subtly playing a possession game where she would routinely squeeze herself in between the other puppies and their owners. all the while they were wrestling and playing but it was clear that my dog was also showing she could clam their owners if she wanted. I watched the two puppies become more agitated as the play went on but I thought perhaps my dog was just coaxing a more competitive spirit out of them since she wasn't actually being rough with her play. then my dog went too far. one of the new pups wanted some reassurance from its owners and my dog promptly cut her off and pushed her away. the other puppy was very upset by this and attacked.

my puppy is so rude and antagonistic to other dogs. very subtly. just enough so that nobody else thinks she is being a bully but I know it. what do I do?
Your dog is young so that behaviour may still change over the next year or so.

For now you shouldn't take her to a dog park, imo. She's disruptive and there's a risk that she'll pick a duel with the wrong dog and get torn up.

If you want to try socializing your dog around other dogs, -- which I think is a good idea -- then dial it back. Take her to puppy training and let her play with one dog at a time in a controlled environment.
 

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We have a small dog park, just opened this year. I only take my dogs there if it is empty. I do not need them to socialize with dogs I do not know. Too many people say "my dog is friendly when they are not". I have just socialized them with dogs I know the temperament of.
 

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An example of how quickly things can turn. The day before yesterday i walked through the empty dog park and out of nowhere in a split second a young cavalier mega fast bolted up to my dog and submitted. My dog stood over it hackles raised and inside growled and thank bloody god he listened to me and smelled the treat bad and came to get the lead on and high tail it out the there with pram in tow.
 
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