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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
We brought Derby home on 2/22, at a little over 8 weeks of age (according to the shelter). The vet records they sent, besides worming solutions, go something like this:

2/1/2017 - canine distemper, infectious canine hepatitis, canine adenovirus type 2, canine parainfluenza and canine parvovirus (Duramune Max 5)

2/2/2017 - Adenovirus, Parainfluenza, Bordetella (Nobivac Intra-Trac 3 ADT)

2/15/2017 - canine distemper, infectious canine hepatitis, canine adenovirus type 2, canine parainfluenza and canine parvovirus (Duramune Max 5)

Now, we just had a visit from our traveling vet this past Monday, who has interpreted these past records to mean, somehow, that Derby has only received ONE combo shot thus far, and her invoice refers to the one she gave him as his 2nd. Have I missed something? She wants to schedule yet another one later this month which she says will be his 3rd, but by my count will be FIVE.

3/6 - Distempr, Adeno2, Parainfluenza, Parvo

Here's what the AAHA gives as guidelines:


Perhaps I'm not up on vaccine protocol, as I simply don't understand why it's so hard to follow the above guidelines. I'm inclined to cancel this next combo vaccine, and just do the rabies. Can someone give me some clarification here? I do titers for my adult dogs, which I know is not foolproof, but I simply refuse to overvaccinate just because vets are in the habit of pushing boosters every year.

Have I missed something? :confused:
 

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Not sure where you got your picture on the AAHA guidelines, but it is very misleading. Based on that image you could interrupt that the last vaccine to protect against Distemper, Parvo, and Adenovirus could be given at 12 weeks of age which is incorrect when compared to the actual AAHA guidlines on their own website. My understanding, based off loads of schooling and CEs from just about every type of source, is that the number of puppy shots given is irrelevant. The most important thing about puppy vaccines is the age of the puppy when the last vaccine is administered and that the vaccine prior to that was given within 2-4 weeks of the last vaccine administration. The AHAA vaccine guidelines is what every vet in the US should be referring to regardless of what type of medicine they practice. I linked to the AHAA vaccine guidelines below for anyone who would like to have a read. And yes the 2011 guidelines is the most up to date ones that we have. I would recommend all puppy and dog owners have a read, it can get a bit complicated with the abbreviations and jargon in some bits, if anyone has trouble reading/understanding it I would be glad to help translate.

https://www.aaha.org/public_documents/professional/guidelines/caninevaccineguidelines.pdf

Based off the info provided I would read your pups info the same way you vet has. If you had an actual birthdate for your pup that may change things. However if he was "a little over 8 wks" on 2/22 based on the shelters opinion, your vet and I would make the assumption and start counting him as 8 wks on 2/22 just to be on the safe side in regards to the age his vaccines are given. With that in mind, his vaccine that was given on 2/1 would have been given at 5 weeks which is too young to be of any use and therefore completely irrelevant. The vaccine given on 2/2 is an intra-nasal vaccine and not counted towards the injectable puppy vaccines even though it does protect against some of the same diseases. Also not sure why they did a nasal vaccine the day after doing an injectable vaccine, that's just very odd, and again your pup was too young when that vaccine was given and your vet will likely recommend that one to be repeated when he's an appropriate age. So the vaccines that are assumed to contribute towards his protective immunity are the ones given on 2/15 and 3/6.

At my work we stopped labling puppy & kitten vaccines with numbers and just list them as vaccine booster or annual vaccine depending on the age of the pet and previous vaccine history. The set number just makes it very confusing for new pet owners to understand when their pet is finished with the vaccine booster series and most people get hung up on the individual number given rather than if their pet is acutally protected. I can't tell you how many times I've seen shelters, and even breeders, start vaccines at as young as 3 weeks or repeated every week and owners arguing that their pet should be fully vaccinated at 8 weeks.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you, animalcracker! I've done another search for AAHA vaccination charts, and have no idea where I got that screenshot; I've had it a couple of years and it's clear now that it is incomplete. I recall, as you said, that vaccines given too early are wasted because of the immunity from maternal nursing.

Although I have looked through the AAHA docs some time back, it's helpful to see these essential guidelines condensed down to an easy to refer to chart, sans extended explanations.

I did find one that lists the extra vaccinations you mention, that are given after the 12-14 week mark (> 16 weeks), but prior to the one year booster/re-vaccination. It's listed under this chart at this vet's blog. After more searching, I'm more inclined to Dr. Jean Dodd's schedule, but since Derby came from a shelter, they evidently had their own more aggressive regimen.

Anyway, I definitely appreciate your explanation, and will take into account the wasted early vaccines and go with our vet's, and the AAHA's recommendations. Thanks!! :)
 

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Dr Dodds vaccine protocol roughly falls in line with the AAHA guidelines, she just skipping the initial vaccine at 6-8 wks and starting a bit later. In theory you only need 2 rounds of puppy shot at the correct age to initiate a protective immune response, so that initial vaccine at the younger age doesn't truly contribute to a dogs final immunity. The problem is that most pet owners are woefully unaware of how those viruses are contracted and do little, if anything, to protect their new pets. Vets have to weigh the odds and also protect their own liability. Typically this means it's going to be better to start the vaccines sooner and get some temporary protection started vs. waiting to start the vaccines so one or two less injections are given.

I did find it interesting that she recommends an additional Parvo shot at 18 weeks old, that's a new one for me. I'd be interested to see what information she has on that. The first vet I ever worked for was in a very high risk Parvo area. We had Parvo puppies in our isolation ward practically year round. We vaccinated our patients against Parvo up to 16 weeks and that appeared to be effective protection for them.

In regards to Rabies, just about every vet I've ever talked to would prefer to follow her 20wk recommendation. Unfortunately idiot politicians seem to think they know everything and that they know what health decisions are best for us and our pets.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I'm now having a disagreement with our vet over Derby's next vaccination appointment. Disregarding the two vaccinations that were given too early at the shelter as mentioned in my first post, he's had his first three DA2PP vaccinations on 2/25, 3/6, and 3/27, but she wants to give the 1 YEAR booster on 4/18. He won't quite be 4 months old at that time. Did I misunderstand all those guidelines I read? She also says: "It doesn't matter how many vaccines he has had, it matters the spacing of them." :confused:

Additionally I do not want to give the 1st rabies vaccination at the same visit as any other vacs, but she's adamant that there's nothing wrong with it. I haven't responded yet, but my conscience won't let me do it after all I've read on these forums and elsewhere.
 

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I can't see why they are arguing this, it's not like waiting a week and having an extra appointment would harm the pup. Providing you don't have a high rabies incidence in wildlife that she'd be exposed to.

Do you have other vets in your area? It seems like you don't have much confidence in this one and have a vet you feel secure with makes things a whole lot less stressful.


If it helps Echo did fine having her Rabies vac with the others at 15 weeks.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
After a few more exchanges further explaining why I made this decision, she finally relented. I think maybe she was putting the spurs to me to see how strong my convictions were. :mad: I can appreciate that she has to fully "inform" her clients as to the risks of not following her regimen for liability reasons, so I'm trying not to be aggravated as she's otherwise a great vet. She's one of two traveling veterinarians in my area, thankfully, so if we have an(other) irreconcilable difference of opinion, I at least have that option.
 
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