[Fiammata]

Okay so I have an outdoor kennel attached to a low-hanging window for my dog to go poo when I'm gone at work. She can get in and out the window via a doggy door, and has no problems understanding the concept, in fact has been trained within very few repetitions to go in and out on command. She also will go out there sometimes on her own.
The problem is she views the kennel as a place NOT to poo, but the area in front of the usual doors as the place TO poo, or any other random corner of the indoor room. She's been confined to the cement-floored room which attaches to both the doors and the kennel for this reason.
I'm trying to train her to use that kennel by not taking her outside where she wants... by waiting until she can't hold it any more, then rewarding her when she goes in the correct location, she should understand the concept enough to go use the kennel if she has to poo while I'm at work, right? Wrong! It's been over a week and I'm soooooo stuck! Her usual routine now is to go out into the kennel (on her own), pace around, come back in, pace around, go out, come in, come to me, go to the big doors and lay down. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. If I leave the room for even 5 minutes she has an accident inside the house, but if I stick around she'll hold it and hold it all day long and into the night if she can. So how do I make the outdoor kennel feel more outdoorsy than inside the house?
She has no problems reaching the kennel, as she goes there on her own with no prompting, and can also go on command (I even call it "outside" to try to teach her it's where to go poo). It's not too small, as it's 6'x10' which is considered MUCH too large for the type of kennel where you train them NOT to poo in. She's able to jog around in it and stand up on her hind legs. Its floor is concrete (outside the window is an enclosed patio, which the kennel was put inside to keep her from marking what's stored out there). But inside the house is concrete too. Being an enclosed patio, there's a sort of a roof, but inside has a roof too, there are ventilated walls, but inside has walls too. She has no problems going outside in the grass, sadly few problems going inside the house, but will hold until the point of bursting rather than go in the kennel.
So how do I make it more appealing to her??
I've tried bringing in pieces of sod from outside. I've tried spreading wood shavings. I have several appropriately sized objects out there, filled with sand, to lure her to marking them. I've tried spraying store-bought scents that are supposed to entice dogs to mark over them. For God's sake, I've even dabbled fox urine out there! (She rolled in that, btw). She HAS gone out there before due to not being able to hold it any longer, so her own scent is out there too, and each time she goes out there I praise her. I've done both extremes of praising, from the ecstatic to the smile and a 'tinkle treat.' She knows what tinkle treats are because I only ever give them to her when she does her business outside in the grass where she was taught to go. Now I give them to her when she goes in the kennel, the few times that she has. If taken outside to the grass, or if I leave her unattended inside the house, she'll do #1 4-7 times a day and usually #2 in the afternoon, maybe the evening. If confined to the kennel, she'll hold BOTH until a little past midnight... once she held both until 3:30am of the next day! If I'm in the room with her that leads to the kennel and she can freely enter and leave it on her own, she does the above-mentioned process of going in and out the kennel (thru the window), going to and from the big doors, pacing around, whining... she eventually starts sniffing around at the big doors and I shoo her to the kennel, telling her to "go outside," "go tinkle," and she goes out there and paces but comes back inside still not emptied, and begins sniffing at the big doors again, only to be shoo'd back out there again...
What am I missing? What can I do to make the OUTSIDE kennel more appealing for poo than inside the house? It's not the outdoor elements that bother her, as she has no problems going on the grass outside. It's also not something about the space that scares her to be in it, as she'll go out there just to sniff the wind or sit sometimes.
Please help me.

 

[Leema]

It sounds like you are doing everything right.

My only guess is that your dog has developed a habit of going inside. To break this habit, I would lock her outside, in her kennel run, for 3 weeks or so she has no opportunities to go in the house. This will hopefully mean that she realises she CAN do it (though at the time she'll have no other option) and, when you allow her inside again, her preference will be the outside.

It's a bit harsh and someone might have a better idea! But this is the best I can think of because, yes, it sounds like you've tried everything - must be getting frustrating!

 

[Tess]

I agree with Leema it sounds like you are doing everything right! She just has such an ingrained habit of going inside, that its going to take longer than a week to change the habit. You need to figure out a way to dis-allow access to the inside when you cannot be there to supervise, so she can NOT make a mistake. Each mistake she makes, keeps strengthening the wrong habit.

I might also investigate why she needs to poo up to 7 times a day. That seems like a lot of times, and could indicate her food does not agree with her, or she is eating too much. Any problems in this area will complicate house training efforts. How are her poos? Are they too soft or too firm? Does she have the "runs" or is pooing little "charcoal briquettes" throughout the day?

A normal adult dog will poo maybe around 2 times per day, although I am sure there is variation on this.

 

[Fiammata]

LoL #2 is poo, correct? #1 is not?

 

[Bones]

You could also try keeping her in a crate while in the house. Dogs usually won't go in a small space- and take her outside as soon as you get home. This way she will associate going outside with potty and being inside with holding it.

Make sure you scrub the places where she goes with an enzymatic cleaner to remove the traces fecal matter or urine- this will reduce the chance of her using the same spot because it smells like a bathroom.

It would also help to keep her tethered to you when you're home so you can correct her and take her out if she tries to go inside. It's a lot of work but I have housebroken all three of my dogs this way and they usually get in a few weeks.

 

[pawzaddict]

You could also try keeping her in a crate while in the house. Dogs usually won't go in a small space- and take her outside as soon as you get home. This way she will associate going outside with potty and being inside with holding it.

THIS!!!! Treat the outdoor kennel like the backyard. She clearly is NOT potty trained so should not have free range of the room AT ALL. I would look into crate training her and instead of letting her out in the backyard, put her directly in the run to go potty. When she goes potty praise her like you have done. However, you need to keep doing this then SLOWLY increase her time out of the crate to roam the house while you are gone.

Using a good cleaning solution inside is great and make sure you don't do it in front of her. I also would NOT correct her at all for going inside. It should be ignored, she should be taken out to the proper place to do business and praised. Then leave her out to play and go inside and clean, or leave her with someone in another room of the house while you clean.

 

[Fiammata]

She only began 'going' indoors when I began withholding her from the grass outside in order to get her to go in the kennel. But it's also been suggested in another forum that she was taught not to poo in kennels by a previous owner....... which definitely holds some possibility. She has a lot of wear on the inside of her top 2 incisor teeth, typical of dogs who chew on wire mesh. So hopefully she can overcome this soon, anyway.

 

[pawzaddict]

why did you start restricting where she could go? can she not just have access like she used to?

 

[Tess]

LoL #2 is poo, correct? #1 is not?

You got it!

two is poo, one is pee!

 

[Fiammata]

...because I need her to learn that the kennel is at least "okay" to go poo in, as that was the whole purpose of building the thing for her. If she has to 'go' and I'm not at home, I need her to go over to the kennel, go poo out there, and then either stay there if she wants to or come back inside: NOT have an accident inside the house and leave the kennel clean.

So I tried the no-nonsense approach of encouraging her to go poo out there, but not allowing access to the grass spot, and in return found out she'd rather have accidents inside the house than go in that spot built especially for her business.

Having that spot out there will be mighty nice come a few weeks from now, when the weather turns vicious outside anyway. Last year the snow DUMPED and she didn't much like that, either. It's ventilated out there but at least not so windy, and not much snow will find its way in. Cold alone doesn't bother her as she has a very thick winter coat.

 

[pawzaddict]

I mean why is the kennel necessary? Can she escape the yard?
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[Dawnben]

Maybe get one of these or make one so she has grass like area to go in

 

[Fiammata]

Yup, tried that with the sod.

Time seems to be helping... but it's an awful long wait. Over a week so far! She still holds it until she can't, then would prefer to sniff indoors for a spot than go to the kennel. But now she's trying a little less hard to hold it. Occassionally I do take her outside to the grass by going through the kennel door (she goes through the window, I meet her on the other end) to imply that the kennel is the new exit place (since she likes to have her accidents at the usual exit place). Of course once she gets outside she goes right away. And, I no longer give her opportunities to have indoor accidents. If I have to leave for 5+ minutes, she's locked in the kennel.

On another forum, someone suggested she may have been taught by a previous owner not to poo in kennels, and that holds some possibility as she has a lot of wear on the inside of her top 2 incisor teeth... typical of dogs who chewed on wire. My intention, btw, is NOT to keep her out there in it, but simply for it to be a place for her to go if she wants to poo and I'm not home to let her out. So she needs to learn it's 'okay' to go there. Once she has a rock-solid understanding of that, I will of course take her outdoors plenty when I'm home to do so.