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Hello Dogforum fellow ! I wasn't sure where to post this whether in dog training or in this section, but here it is !

First at all my dog is a female, around 4 months~
Breed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Setter


So, the problem is that 'she' is really stubborn, when you call her normally she answer and come to you, but once she's getting interested in something she will not answer anymore /care off, I can call her as many time as I want she will just what she wanted to do.

For exemple :

The last time, I was walking my dog and we are passed near a farm and there, she couldn't help but enter the farm to pursue a chicken and at this point, it's just impossible to reason her by screaming her name, she will just keep chasing the chicken until we can grab the dog physically.
It happened twice already and I'm gonna end up having problems with all the farmers from where I live if she keep not being obedient.
I used to kept her on the lead since she was really a little puppy, but recently I'm freeing her when we're somewhere where there isn't any cars ( yes, because she want to follow all the cars, which would be kind of dangerous )
and everything goes well until there isn't any living farm where she can smell the chicken.
Any advice on how to make her more obedient? Scold over instant is not enough, she is really obstinate.

Some problems which could be not a problems :

Sometimes, she bite my fingers ( very smoothly, it doesn't hurt nor it annoys me ), I assume she want to play.

Best regards.
 

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Ah! You've come to the right place. I've had 4 english setters in my life. They are not "obedience dogs"... they are BIRD Dogs! So the first thing to understand is that they are bred to find and pursue game! They are not bred to trot nicely by your side and wait for your command! In this way they are totally different from Labradors, Sheperds, Border Collies etc.

You will NOT be able to call a BIRD dog, off of a chicken! So don't even think that should happen! Its not "stubborness" it is her breeding... her genetics!

There are a couple ways to deal with this problem. It sounds like you live in the country. One thing would be to get your dog used to chickens, as mine are. They no longer chase chickens because they are used to seeing them. It took a long time to get my dogs used to chickens. I can explain that if you want.

The other approach is to not let your dog off leash near chickens! You are correct that a setter MUST have freedom to RUN a lot, as that is what they are bred to do, but you can choose your locations where there are not chickens or cars. Without freedom to run several times a week (every day is ideal) your setter will get very unruly, anxious and ultimately depressed or neurotic!

Well, that is a start. Please let me know if you have more questions. Here is a video of my dogs running. The antennas on their collars are for a GPS tracking device, so if they get out of sight I know where they are!

Tessa737's Channel - YouTube
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks a lot for your informations, well, we're gonna keep her leashed when we're going near farms I guess, what about the fact that she bites our fingers?
I assume it's a game for her, but it is saint to let her do so?

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I knew Tess would jump in on your Qs! :) for the nipping, the easiest way to correct it is to immediately stop giving your dog attention & ignore her for a few minutes if you feel teeth. You can also make a yelping noise when she does this - followed by ignoring - IF it doesn't excite her (yelping makes some dogs more mouthy). :)
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i would also suggest that you practice recalls often, as tess says, your dog is genetically predisposed to run off after birds etc, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't practice, making recall (coming when called) a big fantastic game for her will increase your chances that she will come when you call her. just make sure that you always remember her genetics and have a plan to manage her behavior as well, so call her to you and leash her before you pass a farm with chickens...

on the nipping, ditto seebrown, i would add, try to keep plenty of toys around and play with her with them so that she learns what would be an appropriate thing to bite as well as not to bite you....



Dog | Forum | Rocks!
 

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Yes, practice the recall a LOT! Of course that is very important. Give her treats when she comes to you. Have a party!

As far as the mouthing thing, she is just 4 months old so this is what puppies do. It is very helpful to have something else to put in her mouth. Don't let her have your hand. Also, you should not punish her for this either though, as that will make her nervous and she won't understand why the punishment. Just do a lot of Management of the situation.

In fact, I would say "management" is the most important thing with setters! That means off leash in safe areas only. It also means LOTS of exercise EVERY day or they go nuts and run off when they do get free. Setters are not easy dogs!
 

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Thanks a lot to all of you for very great advice.

@Tess : Well, something like 1-2 hours the morning, 1-2 hours the evening ( total walking/day, pretty often in the forest/mountain, where I live there isn't any flat terrain, we got to go up/down everytime so it makes things harder and more exhausting.
Do you think 3-4 hours of walking/day is enough?

Also, I guess it's just a puppy thing, but once she sees me she just so happy that she hunt me everywhere I go, she rushes on me and at this instant there, impossible to stop it, she wants cuddles, cuddles, cuddles, the only time she do not want cuddles is when I bring her food haha :p

I started to experience her in area like garden, she's almost fine, except today, she's been a very bad girl, she kept going in the neighbours garden even when I reprimand her again, again, again, she even flees when she saw me trying to get her.

I must say, having a dog isn't vacation at all, but still, I like her a lot.

Best regards.
 

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Thanks a lot to all of you for very great advice.

@Tess : Well, something like 1-2 hours the morning, 1-2 hours the evening ( total walking/day, pretty often in the forest/mountain, where I live there isn't any flat terrain, we got to go up/down everytime so it makes things harder and more exhausting.
Do you think 3-4 hours of walking/day is enough?
Yes! I think that is great! Particularly if you are able to let her off the leash some of this time!

Also, I guess it's just a puppy thing, but once she sees me she just so happy that she hunt me everywhere I go, she rushes on me and at this instant there, impossible to stop it, she wants cuddles, cuddles, cuddles, the only time she do not want cuddles is when I bring her food haha :p
Let her be exuberant in her expression of joy to see you. She will settle down as she gets older. Its not good to greet her happiness with anything negative. It will teach her to be timid with you.

I started to experience her in area like garden, she's almost fine, except today, she's been a very bad girl, she kept going in the neighbours garden even when I reprimand her again, again, again, she even flees when she saw me trying to get her.
You mustn't punish her! That only teaches her to be afraid of you or to run the other way. Reprimanding will damage her "recall" response. Secure your fence! A puppy is not capable of curbing their exploration instinct!

And of course you notice the reprimand is not working anyway, and is only having a negative effect. Find another solution! ;)

I must say, having a dog isn't vacation at all, but still, I like her a lot.
Yup! That about summarizes it! :)
 

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Ah, damnet^^ Tess, you're making me having nightmare, how should I handle her when she's being a bad girl ? when she's going in the neighbours garden and so.
Will she get better when she grown ?

Thanks for the replies so far, it really help actually, I don't think you realize how much it can help me actually.

Thanks.

Best regards.
 

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Ah, damnet^^ Tess, you're making me having nightmare, how should I handle her when she's being a bad girl ? when she's going in the neighbours garden and so.
Will she get better when she grown ?

Thanks for the replies so far, it really help actually, I don't think you realize how much it can help me actually.

Thanks.

Best regards.
LOL! I think you are a wonderful owner!
To answer your question... two things..
1) Management!!!! that means Prevent problems by thinking ahead. So have a good fence around your garden, put pup on leash to go past chickens, etc.
2) Teach pup what you WANT her to do. Rather than waiting until she is naughty and trying to stop her (which as you notice does not work very well anyway) teach her an alternative behavior.

For example, if puppy is jumping up on you, rather than correcting her for jumping, teach her a "sit" command, and reward that command. If you do this consistently, she will enjoy the way she can get a positive response from you for sitting, and she will actually start to volunteer this!

Here is my favorite trainer. Watch this and you can learn to train this way. It is very quick and pup will love it!
kikopup's Channel - YouTube

Here is a thread to learn about how to teach puppy good behaviors, so you can ask for what you WANT, rather than feeling like you have to chase pup around stopping her from being naughty. ;)
http://www.dogforum.com/dog-training/helpful-training-videos-articles-11426/

And a couple of my favorite books... you seem up to this, so I'll give you the names!
Here is a terrific puppy book. She's not too old for you to read this! and it is a quick read.
Amazon.com: puppy primer

And here is the best book on understanding how dogs learn!
Amazon.com: Don't Shoot the Dog!: The New Art of Teaching and Training (9781860542381): Karen Pryor: Books

Hope some of that helps. Its enough to keep you busy for a long time, but please don't hesitate to come back and ask questions anytime.


And yes, she will get calmer and better behaved once she gets older, although you'll develop better habits and fewer problems if you take a positive approach. Meanwhile, your challenging months are just starting! Months 5 through 7-ish are probably the toughest!
Right now she's a prescshooler. Pretty soon she'll be a teenager, and truly, its the same for dogs as for kids... you'll need lots of patience and the ability to be 3 steps ahead of her! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Again, thanks a lot, I'm gonna try puppy primer one.

I'm gonna follow your advice yet again.

Daily story : She did vomit today, I'm not sure to know why, actually, it's very very hot here today, like 43 ° celcius, maybe it's because of that, who knows?
Did you already experienced that Tess?

Best regards.
 
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