Dog Forum banner

1 - 9 of 9 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi all! I recently found this gorgeous girl up for adoption. Unfortunately, I wasn't fast enough, and someone else swept her away...

One of the things that really struck me was her unusual look. I've NEVER seen a dog like her before, and I can't even begin to guess at her genetics.

Has anyone seen a dog like this before? How likely am I to encounter another like her? I'm so smitten by her appearance, and would love to target my continued search, if at all possible.

Thanks so much!

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,652 Posts
that on the back looks like a merle pattern.
perhaps a Schäfi x "some kind of aussie or collie"-mix.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
500 Posts
Black & tan, saddle pattern, merle, and some white markings. Merle only affects the black parts of the dog and thus is only visible on the saddle. Saddle makes tan markings of the black and tan larger so that the black area only covers the back and top of the head. German shepherd is the most familiar breed with saddle. Saddle gene is dominant.

The nose looks quite light-colored. I have no idea why.

A merle tricolor bordercollie (or Australian shepherd) x GSD would likely produce a dog colored like that. A merle rough or smooth collie crossed with a GSD can also produce merle saddlebacks with white chest mark but the head would likely be less round and more narrow than the dog in the pic because RC shows on the head in the most RC mixes I have seen pictures of.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
951 Posts
This dog has a collection of modifier genes.

It appears to at it's base be tan with a black blanket (basic german shepherd coloration...but missing the black mask gene)

The eyes and the pattern on the saddle makes me think it is carrying a merle gene. Note, while merle genes give a interesting look, two merle genes often means the animal is blind and/or deaf. Sometimes this gene combo will kill the pup before or shortly after birth. To be safe, a dog with just 1 copy of the merle gene should only be bred to a dog that has no merle genes. Problem is, this means only 25% of pups will have the merle gene. And many people want the merle coloration, which means 75% of the pups are 'less desirable'. This leads some breeders to do a merle x merle breeding, which gives only 25% pups with no merle, 50% 1 copy of merle, and 25% double merle...blind, deaf,or dead. Just be aware of what is going on behind the scenes if you start looking for merle dogs, you can become part of the market forces that push toward what I view as unethical breeding practices.

Anyways moving on, also appears to have the gene for 'irish spotting' i.e. the classic collie white marks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Thanks so much for the information, all! Especially about the complications of merle breeding. Going forward, I'll be careful not to contribute to any unethical breeding (I only look at spayed shelter animals, anyway). :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,208 Posts
I think Australian Cattle dog and German Shepherd are definitely in there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dogs4Jesus

·
Registered
Joined
·
500 Posts
ACD is not merle. It is roan/ticked. So the merle cannot come from there.

And, I correct a previous message by saying, that in Merle x non-Merle pairing, 50 % of the puppies are merle because Merle is dominant and is almost always visible on a dog as long as it has any eumelanin (black pigment or its dilutes) in its coat. If we want to avoid double merle, we breed a merle to a non-merle. A puppy inherits either the merle or non-merle gene from the merle parent and the change of merle is so 50 %. Thus in theory 50 % of the puppies are merle but nature can play a game and produce anything between a litter of non-merles and all merles.

The possible combinations

Mm x mm
Mm
Mm
mm
mm
-> 50 % merle and 50 % non-merle

For comparison I cross Ayat (sable carrying black & tan) with another sable B&T carrier.

Ayat x Ayat
AyAy
Ayat
Ayat
atat
-> 75 % sable, 25 % black & tan.

Was that a Merle x Merle pairing, the homozygous merle (MM, 25 %) would be the double merle and likely disabled, 50 % normal merles and 25 % non-merles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
812 Posts
Ummmm, it kinda looks like an overgrown Corgi. ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: patronizingrabbits

·
Registered
Joined
·
951 Posts
And, I correct a previous message by saying, that in Merle x non-Merle pairing, 50 % of the puppies are merle because Merle is dominant and is almost always visible on a dog as long as it has any eumelanin (black pigment or its dilutes) in its coat. If we want to avoid double merle, we breed a merle to a non-merle. A puppy inherits either the merle or non-merle gene from the merle parent and the change of merle is so 50 %. Thus in theory 50 % of the puppies are merle but nature can play a game and produce anything between a litter of non-merles and all merles.

The possible combinations

Mm x mm
Mm
Mm
mm
mm
-> 50 % merle and 50 % non-merle
You are correct, I misspoke when I stated only 25% come out merle, 50% do. And of course single copy merle x non-merle is an ethical breeding.
 
1 - 9 of 9 Posts
Top