[Eveee]

Hi there, not sure if anyone has followed my journey with my Cattledog mix. He’s now becoming a real adolescent (6-7 month) and his breed nature is showing! I knew it was going to be a massive challenge, but I think I’m now fully understanding the scope of it. A few weeks back I mentioned that he started biting and getting frustrated in random situations on walks or when he gets overstimulated. Mainly in the park when he sees other dogs running around that he wants to play with but can’t. He’s extremely dog-focused and loves playing, however his play style is quite mouthy and annoying and not always appreciated by other dog owners which is why I have restricted him a bit more. I don’t want to be rude towards other people especially since he doesn’t have a great recall yet.
I’ve been working with a trainer to train recall, calming behaviour and settle on his mat in the park, but his frustration tolerance has actually gotten much worse, which I’m blaming myself for not giving him a proper and safe outlet.
This morning was the worst so far. I sat down at the park for 5 minutes, put his mat out and giving him treats for laying on his place (I do this a lot so he learns to stay calm and desensitise to the environment) but he already started growling and barking at me, refusing food or toys and biting anything that’s in his way - His leash, my arms, legs, bag. Literally anything. So usually I wave a toy at him to redirect but he wouldn’t take it, and food will only do the job very briefly. I decided to leave the park as it’s obviously too much going on for him to handle (he did NOT wanna go) and I had a biting, frustrated little monster clenching on me the entire 3 minute walk home, besides me trying to ignore him and turning away and/or redirecting him. Freezing and ignoring him is getting increasingly hard as his bites are pretty intense and I can’t just walk away in the middle of the road. A few more pretty hefty bruises later and quite some destructive behaviour following at home, I’ve unfortunately lost my cool and had to have a cry. Ouch!! (Really just sharing my real life experience here, please don’t judge me. I’m aware he’s a working dog, but I’m committed to doing the right thing, and it’s all a learning curve)
I pulled myself together and started doing some more research.. I wanna do right by him, so here I am asking once again for a bit of advice.
I think his frustration is coming from being restrained when he wants to play with dogs and as he gets older he obviously needs to be able to run around off leash more often and let off some energy, which I want to provide.
However dog parks aren’t really an option ( i really tried) as he’s too dog focused and won’t come back to me. We’re working on a good recall with long leash, but it’s taking it’s time especially since it’s hard to find less distracting areas to train him.
My question is however, does he even need a lot of time with other dogs? Should I let him off more often in the off leash area instead of restricting him to meet his needs? He’s friendly, and besides being mouthy doesn’t hurt other dogs, but still rather annoying. Some adult dogs can get really pissed off. Or should I entirely avoid the park for now to prevent him going over his threshold, until he’s a bit more desensitised?
Again: His play style is quite intense and not always appreciated, so I’ve only let him play with well mannered friends dogs that can handle and teach him, and I can pull him back when things get too crazy. However once I take him back, he tends to get really frustrated and let it out on me again. Playing with friends is also not a daily option, maybe once a week or once every 2nd week. Is that enough dog play for him? Or is it better I focus on human/dog play time? What’s the best bet here?
Other outlets for energy are getting up at 6am before breakfast and taking him to an empty park, playing fetch, working on recall etc. so he can let off some build up energy but won’t be distracted by other dogs. We’re still in lockdown and I cant go further than 5km, which makes it hard to go out into proper nature and big empty fields, which I would prefer doing. My options are unfortunately a bit limited, besides having all the right intentions.
He gets plenty of on leash walks and in house and garden play time and training, which is going really really great. We have mentally stimulating toys and are able to occupy him this way. However proper off leash running and play is coming short I’m realising. (I think?) How much should he have at this age? Will it become naturally easier with time so he won’t be too focused on other dogs as he gets older? I’m feeling a bit overwhelmed and sometimes very unsure as to what is the right approach - Any guidance, ideas and similar experience are as always greatly appreciated.

 

[CachetheBC]

I would suggest staying away from the dog park for now, he can learn to be more socially appropriate from your friends dogs he is familiar with, and who can and will teach him appropriate dog social skills. Aside from upsetting other dog owners, there is a risk of him running into a dog who may not tolerate his 'rude' (normal for his age) puppy behavior, which could end up with a less than pleasant outcome for him- and you don't want him to become afraid of other dogs.

Self control/tolerance for frustration does tend to improve with practice (settle, wait, stay, leave it), maturity plays a big part in it as well. While off leash play with other dogs is enjoyable for most dogs, they don't necessarily need it on a frequent basis (as long as they have other opportunities to appropriately use their energy) in order to learn appropriate dog behavior from other dogs. (Some dogs find too much interaction with other dogs stressful/anxiety producing).

I would suggest focusing more on helping him learn from you those behaviors you want him to have, teaching (lots of repetition so they become reliable in a variety of situations/locations etc.) of basic skills at home and out on walks, teaching him tricks/fun things to do. The more we work with them, especially when they are young, the better our communication skills become, (communication goes both ways) the stronger our connection and bond with our dog. Also don't forget to take a 'day off' now and again, learning is hard work for our pups and sometimes they just need to rest their brain a bit, chill out and relax.

My border collie/Aussie shepherd pup is a little older than yours, and I can certainly relate to the challenges you are having but it does get better, easier - it just takes time. Though it does sound like you are doing a wonderful job with your pup!

 

[JoanneF]

As above. I also wondered about getting him into a dog sport as a focus for his energy, like flyball or agility (he might be restricted in what he can do until his growth plates are closed, but he could still do some of it). There would be other dogs though, so it might not work, but it's maybe worth considering.

 

[Shadowfox]

We've all wanted to pull out our hair, grit our teeth, or cry. Some of us all three. And not limited to first timers. So, you are definitely not alone!
While he's still learning dog manners, I'd suggest keep doing what you're doing. Only good dog friends, once a week/every other week should be fine. He doesn't need a ton of dog time. He will likely become less focused on them as he gets older.
I'd avoid the park for 2 weeks to see if it tamps down his frustration threshold. Like stress, frustration can stack up and require less to tip the balance.
Somewhere around 30- hour at a time is a ballpark on exercise for his age. Over-tired is a thing. But, you know him best.
For impulse control, I like to put them in a stay, then show something vaguely interesting. Enough to grab notice, but easy to ignore. Then slowly build up to dynamic, like a bouncing ball and outside the home.

But, more questions from me.
Do you let him.play first? Training beginning, middle, and end? I'd try switching the order up and see what happens. I'd also try "changing location" and try again if he seems a bit rowdy, but only something like one end of the park.
Have you tried playing soccer/football off-leash with a ball he can bite? I'd try this at home first, especially since while it could help, it might wind him up more.
Letting him sniff more on a walk, throwing treats into grass or gravel (safety first) for him to find, letting him climb on age-appropriate objects could be considerations.
You got this!

 

[Shadowfox]

Don't know if this'll work, but....

A two leash method has been suggested to me (so you can drop one and lead him away/circle), as well as threading part of the leash through a pool noodle to give you the ability to block off space to get a body part. And while I can't vouch for them really, since retrievers are terribly mouthy pups, an old golden forum might be some help?

Over-Arousal Biting in Puppies: Support Group

There are a few of us (just a few!) out there who are suffering from over-arousal biting with our pups. (Mine is also having puppy tantrums.) This is not typical puppy nipping, but rather harder biting that seems to happen at certain times, especially outdoors, on walks, etc. I thought we...

www.goldenretrieverforum.com

 

[Eveee]

thanks everyone for responding! I’ve read all your comments. I got a bit sick over the last few days and didn’t really get the chance to respond here, but I appreciate all your advice ☺ Just giving a quick update:
We’ve been avoiding that particular park and been going to a different one very early in the morning for some off leash time, which has improved his frustration level immensely. There’s barely any people there in the morning, so it’s been great working on a better recall. Seems like that’s a good solution for now until more distractions can be introduced again.
I definitely want to consider agility in the future when he’s older. I think he’d love it and be great at it.
@Shadowfox thanks for the link, definitely having a look at it.

 

[CachetheBC]

Something that works well for my border collie/Aussie shepherd pup, to enable him to be a calmer and more attentive pup on walks, is to play fetch with him for 5 or 10 minutes before taking him out on leash. (By 'playing fetch' I mean gentle tosses of the ball or frisbee that allow him to chase and run around a bit, not hard throws that would incite him to run hard after it.) It helps to minimize the frustration and 'disconnect' (due to pent up energy) that can happen when we first start out, (if I don't play with him first). I know it sounds 'counter intuitive' to (potentially) get him 'wound up' before taking him out, but having a chance to burn off that initial spurt of energy makes a big difference for him (and a much nicer walk for both of us).

 

[mirdive]

When Genki was little, she would act this way when she got over tired. I'm not sure if that might be part of what you are seeing here but we found that enforcing regular time-outs (which quickly became naps!) by putting her in a crate or x-pen with something to chew really helped avoid "Snapping turtle mode".
We were very lucky that Genki has wanted to stay with me since she was very very small so we have been able to take her off leash on hiking trails and either throw a toy or else just let her orbit me and explore. My partner and I also played a lot of puppy ping pong with treats in the back yard. Fun, good exercise and helps with recall.