German Shepherd - isolate or try to integrate more

223 Views 8 Replies 5 Participants Last post by Curls, 5 d ago

Raycyrx

Discussion Starter · 6 d ago

Background:
We adopted a German Shepherd in late 2018 from a local breeder (my wife found). We brought this new puppy into a household of nine people, two other dogs, and two bunnies. The other two dogs were a full blood husky, and pug mutt. GS: female, husky: female, pug/mutt: male. The first year or so went relatively smooth. Then one day the shepherd decided that the husky was an enemy. Shepherd would attack the husky (brutally, blood drawing bites on the neck) without any provocation. Meanwhile, the pug/mutt and the shepherd got along great. Played together very well... including play fighting. But we could not have the husky and the shepherd in a room at the same time. One of the later attacks caused so much damage to the husky that we rang up $2000 in vet bills.

We tried professional behavior training, and it was a miserable failure. The shepherd would not come out of her pen/cage at the trainers for daily instruction... too scared. We had many arguments about giving up the shepherd to someone who could give her better/more focused attention, but I lost all those arguments.

Fast forward to now. The pug/mutt died suddenly of unknown/acute illness (2021). The husky has died from essentially old age (12/23/22). The shepherd is now our only dog. We had erected privacy fence around our entire back yard to keep the shepherd from escaping (she can jump VERY high), and causing an incident with any neighbors. She is a very sweet dog with household members, but she turned on the husky so dramatically that we completely isolate her from any visitors. This also means I do not take her out on neighborhood walks. During covid lockdown, such walks had been a decent escape, but we just don't risk it currently.

All of this isolation makes me think we might be overdoing it... and making her fear/anxiety of strangers even worse. I've recently thought about taking her on walks again to start to let her know that others out there aren't so scary. During previous walks, I was successful at warning others not to approach as we don't trust the dog.

As I'm not a dog behavior expert, I'm asking for advice.

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JoanneF

· #2 · 6 d ago

Is it only the husky that she had a problem with? Because if that's the case, the combination of living in the same household, and hormones (because it sounds like this started when she was around a year old) could have been the problem. Two females, once they take a dislike to each other, will behave like this. There's a saying, males fight for breeding rights but females fight for breathing rights.

From what you have said, there's no indication she would be likely to behave in the same way with any other dog or person.

But, that said, I wouldn't encourage her to meet other dogs. If she can observe them at a distance where she is aware but relaxed, you can feed her fabulous treats to create a positive emotional response.

What did the trainer that you had do, that made her afraid to come out of her crate?

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Raycyrx

Discussion Starter · #3 · 6 d ago

Trainer used treats and other positive reinforcement to coax the Shepherd (Jaiden) out of her cage. Even when finally out, Jaiden was too scared to participate.

When we did walk her around the neighborhood, she would bark at other people & dogs... Incessantly. Could not get her to calm down other than to simply keep walking.

She did (reportedly) "bite" my nephew, but she was still a small(er) puppy at the time and my nephew could have easily provoked it (on purpose or by accident). I air quote bite because it was a nip that did not break the skin. Still, it was aggressive defensive enough to add to our concerns as opposed to brushing it off as a non-event.

I will add that since she got along so well with the pug/mutt that she picked up, shall we say, little dog habits. The pug/mutt (Link) would bark endlessly at any movement outside. This would get Jaiden going and the barking fed off each other. Since Link's gone, Jaiden has calmed down significantly... But still attacked the husky and barks (aggressively/alarm bell) when any of us arrive home. She can clearly see the arrival is a household member but still has to act the guardian.

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JoanneF

· #4 · 6 d ago

It sounds like the behaviour of a nervous dog, the barking is often a 'back off' message to other dogs and people.

So, can you take her somewhere very quiet with people in the background, where she can observe but not interact.
She will have an invisible radius of space around her where she feels secure. It's called flight distance, anything within that space triggers her fight or flight stress response, which you may have heard of. Find out what that is and keep her far enough away from other dogs/people that she is aware of them, but relaxed. Your goal is to train that she doesn't need to react; not to stop a reaction in progress.

Reward her for being calm with something fabulous, like frankfurter sausage or a very special toy. The aim of this is to change your dog’s emotional response to the stressful thing (the other dog or person) by repeatedly pairing it with something good. In time, your dog will learn that scary dogs mean sausages appear and this creates something called a positive conditioned emotional response (+CER).

This website explains it in more detail - Care for Reactive Dogs

Gradually, over weeks and months rather than days, you can work on reducing the distance. This may mean you have to be selective where you walk - choose places with good visibility so you can give other dogs a wide berth, or where you can turn and walk away easily. But - be aware that if your dog has had a stressful episode the stress hormone cortisol can stay in the body for some time. Studies in dogs are inconclusive but it may be several days. That means that if her cortisol level is already high, the distance she was comfortable with on one day might be too close on another day. So the safe distance can change, watch her body language.

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BigBlackDog

· #5 · 6 d ago

I've had several german Shepherds over the years, and my previous dog was exactly like this. She would bark when anyone other than me came into the house. It's an alert bark, and had nothing to do with anxiety or fear, just an announcement of the arrival.

German Shepherds tend to be vocal, and announcing an arrival is pretty normal. Generally speaking, they tend to have a suspicious nature, which is why people like them as watchdogs.

But it can also lead to the kind of issues you've mentioned. GSDs need to be exposed to things, people and dogs and kids and traffic and stuff, so they can learn what is and is not a potential threat.

And that's precisely why keeping your dog isolated is probably the worst thing you can do!

See if your trainer could meet with you at a park or somewhere outdoors where the dog is more comfortable. If you can stay calm, use distance to keep your dog under threshold (aka not freaking out), and just let her soak in the sights and sounds, she'll likely overcome a lot of that fearfulness, so you can work on more foundational obedience things and build her confidence as well.

But remember, if you're tense she will sense that and will be too, so it's really important to project and calm, confident manor when working with your dog. A trainer should be able to help you with that.

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Raycyrx

Discussion Starter · #6 · 5 d ago

JoanneF said:
Is it only the husky that she had a problem with? Because if that's the case, the combination of living in the same household, and hormones (because it sounds like this started when she was around a year old) could have been the problem. Two females, once they take a dislike to each other, will behave like this. There's a saying, males fight for breeding rights but females fight for breathing rights.

From what you have said, there's no indication she would be likely to behave in the same way with any other dog or person.

But, that said, I wouldn't encourage her to meet other dogs. If she can observe them at a distance where she is aware but relaxed, you can feed her fabulous treats to create a positive emotional response.

What did the trainer that you had do, that made her afraid to come out of her crate?

To me it is significant that the Shepherd had a problem with the husky, but the husky never made a move against the Shepherd. In fact the husky became quite afraid of the Shepherd. The husky was aging when we first got the Shepherd and was mostly sedentary during the time we had both. The husky mostly wanted to be left alone and not really deal with the other dogs. That, of course, turned to fear as the husky got attacked more.

Not sure if that adds any useful information, but I would think it is significant.

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CachetheBC

· #7 · 5 d ago

I have been down this road with a couple of my dogs and can understand the thought process of considering keeping the dog at home where it is safe and feels safe. Working with and helping a reactive dog see the world in a more positive light, is indeed a commitment of time, energy, and learning (for both of us), but it has been so worth it - long run.

I found the book: The Feisty Fido – Patricia McConnell (well worth reading more than once) helpful in understanding what was going on with my reactive dogs and provided guidance in how to work with them and (ultimately) give them a chance to enjoy a pretty normal dog's life.

The book: The Cautious Canine – Patricia McConnell is a good read as well.

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JoanneF

· #8 · 5 d ago

Raycyrx said:
the Shepherd had a problem with the husky, but the husky never made a move against the Shepherd

I do understand your point but living in the same home adds a huge amount. Seeing other dogs from a distance, but not being restricted to the same space or having to interact is a whole different ball game.

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Curls

· #9 · 5 d ago

I have a reactive dog: not aggressive, but definitely reactive. I agree that you need to take your dog out in the world and gradually expose her to the sights and sounds of places other than home. It's good for her mind to get some stimulation, and there will certainly come a time when she will need to be able to handle exposure to a situation outside the house.

Something I find helpful with fearful animals is to work with them ahead of time to establish a few commands you expect them to follow and that are always HIGHLY rewarded: walking at heel, looking at you, sitting on command, things like that. Then, when you are out with them, they have a fallback behavior when they aren't sure how to behave: "If I do this, then everything will be ok." A scenario might be that your girl sees another dog in the distance and starts to get tense. Before she has her meltdown, call her to heel and turn the other way. Reward her for following, and keep moving away. This establishes to her that YOU have the situation under control. You are so unconcerned about the situation that you have brought out the snacks. She doesn't need to worry her pretty little head about dealing with the other dog.

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