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I have a 13 week old male Yorkshire terrier puppy. He is on a dry only diet and on the Royal Canin Yorkshire Terrier breed specific range which he loves and he is looking well on so I have no queries with that.
However I'm having difficulties regarding the amount to feed him and how often. The bag recommends as a guideline he should be having 54g if he's going to make a 2 kg adult. My old Yorkie was just over 3kg so I tried paying him to the recommended daily allowance for a 3kg adult but he was not able to eat all of that so I've moved him down.
At three months he is now having 54g and it recommends spreading over three feeds. With his breakfast he eats everything I put down straight away and he does the same with his evening feed, however his afternoon feed he never seems fussed on it and tends to leave it. My trainer has told me not to leave food down for him because it's not good for him to graze and if he walks away from it, to pick up the dish and give him nothing until his next feed. However, he will still not eat his afternoon feed so I wondered whether I should only be giving him 2 feeds a day? Otherwise I'm just throwing biscuits away.
I've tried to make his breakfast and dinner feeds bigger and give him a small amount at lunchtime but he is just not interested at all and is not touching it?
Any advice would be welcome on what I can do x
 

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I would just try feeding him twice a day. My little aussie was getting way to much food and was refusing to eat. If dog does not want to eat, either they're not hungry or there is something wrong.
 

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I would just try feeding him twice a day. My little aussie was getting way to much food and was refusing to eat. If dog does not want to eat, either they're not hungry or there is something wrong.[/QUOTE

Hi, thank you for your response.

He eats his breakfast and dinner with gusto and enjoys it so I don't think there's anything wrong but I'm just guessing that halfway through the day he maybe doesn't fancy more food :/
 

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Back of the bag guidelines are rough estimates not hard rules. Every dog is different, if he can't finish his meal, he might not be that hungry.
 

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The food you feed is full of fillers that fill him up. Its like you eating 10 crackers with a meal. You would be so full of crackers you could not eat your real food. I would look into a better quality food. I know you did not ask but when I see people feeding foods like royal canine if just really bothers me.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Back of the bag guidelines are rough estimates not hard rules. Every dog is different, if he can't finish his meal, he might not be that hungry.
Hi,
Thank you for your post.
I know the back of the bag is a guideline only so I'm not worried if he isnt eating the daily amount but my concern was more that he has no appetite during the daytime and whether it would be acceptable to only provide him 2 feeds a day? I know it's recommended that they should be fed three times during the day yet he never eats his middle meal.
My concern is more whether it can damage growth or the tummy of a young puppy?
 

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The food you feed is full of fillers that fill him up. Its like you eating 10 crackers with a meal. You would be so full of crackers you could not eat your real food. I would look into a better quality food. I know you did not ask but when I see people feeding foods like royal canine if just really bothers me.
Hello,

Yes you're correct I did not ask for your input as to what I fed my dog and your response bothers me, this is why:
My post didn't ask for peoples opinions on whether they think what I feed my dog is right or wrong. This food has been approved by my vet, my dogs trainer and by the breeder that I purchased him from who was kennel club registered. Looking at your profile I can't see that you are a trained nutritionist for dogs so correct me if I'm wrong but I don't really see what experience you have to comment on what I feed my dog other than what you have said your dogs?
I also find it quite irritating when people feel the need to comment on things that aren't their business. My post is simply questioning whether him not wanting his third feed in the afternoon means I can feed him twice a day and my only concern is for whether it can damage his growth if he's not getting small regular meals.
It's all very well coming on my posting and commenting that what I'm feeding my dog isn't good enough and that it "bothers" you but yet you don't take the time to be helpful and recommend a good alternative or to give me a little bit more information.
Therefore I find your post quite irritating because it's not very helpful and it's really just you being judgemental and passing off a flyaway comment without giving any help.
My puppy is happy, healthy and full of life on his food, I've spent a lot of time reading into his food and I've also run through it with the people who actually know him and see him and I have no issues so I will continue to feed him this "bulky crap food that is the equivalent of 10 crackers per meal" as you put it and until I have somebody with genuine knowledge who can help me otherwise and maybe could help me to consider an alternative brand, that's what I will be feeding him.
I appreciate you think in your own way you are trying to help with your comment but it really does annoy me when there are people like you on these forums he just add brash, unhelpful comments which are very judgemental and a little bit rude.
I don't feel that you're going to actually be able to provide me with any help so I would appreciate it if you just kindly skipped past my posts as my lacklustre way of raising my dog will be of no interest to you
 

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Personally the whole "needs three meals a day" isn't a requirement to me. It also doesn't help with proper growth, it actually is to help prevent "empty stomach" where the puppy, who is digesting his food quickly like a baby, uses up said food and become hypoglycaemic. Hypoglycaemia is a concern, especially in energetic small breeds.

You can definitely try just 2 meals a day, especially if your pup is not interested in a 3rd meal. You don't want force him to eat, but I would provide a snack in the middle. Maybe try some canned food that matches his dry formula.

*I will also add that you are correct that no one truly knows which food is correct for long term use in dogs, just that some dogs do amazing on Orijen and other's do amazing on Purina. Even dog nutritionists are stumped, they can break down the exact needs of a dog, and I think we can all agree that whole foods are always going to be better then scientifically modified foods, but formulating only one food choice to feed all dogs is difficult.

There are no studies to say one food is necessarily better over another, this includes what I feed my dog, raw diets, and other commercial foods because each dog is an individual so studies results are hard to be completely uniform - i.e.: one dog thrives on raw, another on "premium kibble" and another on no-name brand.

Royal Canin certainly isn't one of the worsts out there, either is Hill's. The research and testing both these companies do on their foods is extensive and definitely make them foods I would feed if my dog did well with corn and wheat in her diet - she doesn't. I know plenty of Lab breeders who prefer Proplan for their dogs and many more that prefer Royal Canin. Food is just a human preference and I say if the dog does well on the one you've chosen then there is no need to justify your choice.
 

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Hi,
Thank you for your post.
I know the back of the bag is a guideline only so I'm not worried if he isnt eating the daily amount but my concern was more that he has no appetite during the daytime and whether it would be acceptable to only provide him 2 feeds a day? I know it's recommended that they should be fed three times during the day yet he never eats his middle meal.
My concern is more whether it can damage growth or the tummy of a young puppy?
One of my dog eats once a day and she has free access to her food all day long. My other dog would finish the bag if he could and eats anytime I put food infront of him (or within 10 ft). It just depends on the dog

I don't think its that big of a deal. The food is 'balanced' so each bit of kibble has all the nutrients he needs he's not going to be malnourished if he doesn't eat three times a day.

A vet told me re: food amounts. Let the dog tell you how much it needs, if he's let him eat as much as he wants if he's not getting fat. If he starts to look a little chubby, cut down on the food.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Personally the whole "needs three meals a day" isn't a requirement to me. It also doesn't help with proper growth, it actually is to help prevent "empty stomach" where the puppy, who is digesting his food quickly like a baby, uses up said food and become hypoglycaemic. Hypoglycaemia is a concern, especially in energetic small breeds.

You can definitely try just 2 meals a day, especially if your pup is not interested in a 3rd meal. You don't want force him to eat, but I would provide a snack in the middle. Maybe try some canned food that matches his dry formula.

*I will also add that you are correct that no one truly knows which food is correct for long term use in dogs, just that some dogs do amazing on Orijen and other's do amazing on Purina. Even dog nutritionists are stumped, they can break down the exact needs of a dog, and I think we can all agree that whole foods are always going to be better then scientifically modified foods, but formulating only one food choice to feed all dogs is difficult.

There are no studies to say one food is necessarily better over another, this includes what I feed my dog, raw diets, and other commercial foods because each dog is an individual so studies results are hard to be completely uniform - i.e.: one dog thrives on raw, another on "premium kibble" and another on no-name brand.

Royal Canin certainly isn't one of the worsts out there, either is Hill's. The research and testing both these companies do on their foods is extensive and definitely make them foods I would feed if my dog did well with corn and wheat in her diet - she doesn't. I know plenty of Lab breeders who prefer Proplan for their dogs and many more that prefer Royal Canin. Food is just a human preference and I say if the dog does well on the one you've chosen then there is no need to justify your choice.

Hi,
Thank you for your kind words.
I agree, I am not really a fan of this whole three meals a day thing. When I first got him, I would give him his daily allowance in two feeds and just leave the bowl down all day. However, I was told by my dog trainer that was the incorrect thing to do because dogs don't naturally graze? That's the plan that we followed with our old Yorkshire terrier who passed away in January at the ripe old age of 16 however he was fed on a diet of wet food.

I'm sure there are lots of different methods of feeding. I see a lot of people raving about the raw diet but I've read a lot to suggest that the modern day domestic canine is nowhere near the same build or dietary requirements of their wild ancestors, therefore they don't really benefit much more from being on a raw diet.
I totally agree it's what you feel happy feeding your dog, my puppy is very happy on his current brand of food. He has normal bowel movements and toiletries, he is very happy healthy and alert and has a clean bill of health and well-being from his vet and trainer.
For me as I've said above, I just don't like it when somebody comes and tells me definitively the choice I've made is incorrect when they don't have any proof or knowledge other than that and experience. That's the same reason I would never criticise anybody on feeding their dog and I'm happy with that. If somebody feed their dog supermarket food, I just nod and smile politely and I leave it up to them as it's their choice. My old Yorkshire terrier lived on a diet of supermarket foods such as pedigree chum, butchers and bakers. Mind you that was 16 years ago before there was so much knowledge on dog food but he lived a long and happy life on these poor quality foods x
 

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Hi,
Thank you for your post.
I know the back of the bag is a guideline only so I'm not worried if he isnt eating the daily amount but my concern was more that he has no appetite during the daytime and whether it would be acceptable to only provide him 2 feeds a day? I know it's recommended that they should be fed three times during the day yet he never eats his middle meal.
My concern is more whether it can damage growth or the tummy of a young puppy?
One of my dog eats once a day and she has free access to her food all day long. My other dog would finish the bag if he could and eats anytime I put food infront of him (or within 10 ft). It just depends on the dog

I don't think its that big of a deal. The food is 'balanced' so each bit of kibble has all the nutrients he needs he's not going to be malnourished if he doesn't eat three times a day.

A vet told me re: food amounts. Let the dog tell you how much it needs, if he's let him eat as much as he wants if he's not getting fat. If he starts to look a little chubby, cut down on the food.
I do definitely agree with you, my old York he was very much just fed little and often throughout the day and left a long happy life. I did originally start feeding Teddy one meal in the morning which was left down and then a fresh dish in the evening but my trainer told me that it can encourage a dog to become fussy and also they see themselves as the alpha male because they don't naturally graze on food.
Of course, I do not want to be wasting food by just leaving it down all day and I do not want to create a fussy dog but nor do I want him to stuff himself because he thinks it will be hours until his next meal.
The feedback that I got from the vet at his last checkup is that while he isn't actually overweight, he certainly has plenty on him. She did advise that that is a normal thing for a puppy so I don't think he is lacking in his food but he's on the lowest weight/feed ratio a Yorkshire terrier can be. I think I'm going to slightly decreased the daily allowance and do it in two feeds and see how we goes. I may also go back to leaving it down all day as well as I can understand a little dog of his size may not have the capacity to wolf down a large meal in one go like a big dog. Nor do I want to encourage him to bolt his food down and become food aggressive because he doesn't know when the next meal is coming
 

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Hi,
I see a lot of people raving about the raw diet but I've read a lot to suggest that the modern day domestic canine is nowhere near the same build or dietary requirements of their wild ancestors, therefore they don't really benefit much more from being on a raw diet.
I put my spaniel mix on raw food, solely for his teeth. Both my dogs were rescues, no idea how old either of them are other than approximation. Both their teeth were not in good shape, but Bailey's were deplorable. All of his molars were 100% covered in tartar and the canines were discolored. And of course, red bleeding gums. Their teeth were so bad that I started them on small kibble cause their gums hurt too much to crunch the large.

Did much research, tried edible store bought chews, rawhide, vegetable chews, yak milk chews. Nothing really seemed to work. Whoever had them before AFAICT never played with them or gave them any toys because they won't even look at a rubber toy or non-edible chew no matter how much I coax.

Brushing cleaned up my lab's teeth quite a bit but Bailey's showed marginal improvement.

Everything I read kept pointing to raw meaty bones. So with some trepidation, I got some oxtails and started feeding those once a week. Then twice a week. My lab's teeth again, showed noticeable improvement, Bailey's teeth finally started looking whiter. But still a lot of tartar.

So I thought I'd try them both on raw. My lab didn't so well the first meal for a couple reasons, so I kept her on kibble. I'm feeding her Eukanuba, she's fine on it.

Bailey? OMG he took to raw like a champ, loves it. Loves almost everything I've fed him (doesn't like kidney or poultry livers unless I cook them, kind of lukewarm about chicken but he eats that). After about 3 weeks his teeth were sparkling white, no sign of tartar. His canines still show a little discoloration and his gums are still a little red so I still brush once a week or so.

He's past due to be clipped so I can't see very well how it's affecting his physique, but he is doing the more energy thing. He's got a rough coat (wish I knew what breed in his heritage gave him that) so maybe clipping it off will see if his fur has improved. But definitely see no reason to take him off raw food in the meantime.
 

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i also had to put my Jessie on raw food too she was having so many health issues 3 days onto raw her urine PH was normal again and been no crystals either! her body condition and skin are so much healthier! and much much more
 

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Hi,
I see a lot of people raving about the raw diet but I've read a lot to suggest that the modern day domestic canine is nowhere near the same build or dietary requirements of their wild ancestors, therefore they don't really benefit much more from being on a raw diet.
I put my spaniel mix on raw food, solely for his teeth. Both my dogs were rescues, no idea how old either of them are other than approximation. Both their teeth were not in good shape, but Bailey's were deplorable. All of his molars were 100% covered in tartar and the canines were discolored. And of course, red bleeding gums. Their teeth were so bad that I started them on small kibble cause their gums hurt too much to crunch the large.

Did much research, tried edible store bought chews, rawhide, vegetable chews, yak milk chews. Nothing really seemed to work. Whoever had them before AFAICT never played with them or gave them any toys because they won't even look at a rubber toy or non-edible chew no matter how much I coax.

Brushing cleaned up my lab's teeth quite a bit but Bailey's showed marginal improvement.

Everything I read kept pointing to raw meaty bones. So with some trepidation, I got some oxtails and started feeding those once a week. Then twice a week. My lab's teeth again, showed noticeable improvement, Bailey's teeth finally started looking whiter. But still a lot of tartar.

So I thought I'd try them both on raw. My lab didn't so well the first meal for a couple reasons, so I kept her on kibble. I'm feeding her Eukanuba, she's fine on it.

Bailey? OMG he took to raw like a champ, loves it. Loves almost everything I've fed him (doesn't like kidney or poultry livers unless I cook them, kind of lukewarm about chicken but he eats that). After about 3 weeks his teeth were sparkling white, no sign of tartar. His canines still show a little discoloration and his gums are still a little red so I still brush once a week or so.

He's past due to be clipped so I can't see very well how it's affecting his physique, but he is doing the more energy thing. He's got a rough coat (wish I knew what breed in his heritage gave him that) so maybe clipping it off will see if his fur has improved. But definitely see no reason to take him off raw food in the meantime.
No definitely, I completely agree with you and it sounds like you're doing the best thing for your dog. I think at the end of the day you feed the dog what you're happy feeding them.
My comment only refers to the fact that whilst a lot of research and reading all points to raw diet being the new big thing, a lot of the trainers say that the domestic dog is a far cry from their wild ancestors so they don't need the raw diet. I'm not a nutritionist so I can't say either way, it's just not a diet I would use with my current.dog. My previous dog would also get really bad diarrhoea when I fed her any meat; raw or cooked. I think it just depends on the different dog but I think sometimes it's the best option for dogs who don't agree with dry diets or canned x
 

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i also had to put my Jessie on raw food too she was having so many health issues 3 days onto raw her urine PH was normal again and been no crystals either! her body condition and skin are so much healthier! and much much more
That is great to hear! Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking the raw diet at all. I think you need to choose to feed your dog what suits you best and only you who's with your dog all day, seeing their general well-being and outlook on life and also their condition can make that judgement.
As above, my comment only refers to what my trainer has said to me and I've heard echoed a few times that basically the domestic dog is a far cry from its wild ancestors so they don't have such a need to be fed raw meat and bones. As I say, my old dog would have terrible diarrhoea if I ever fed her any raw meat or cooked yet she would enjoy a hambone with all the raw meat on and suffered no ill effects?
You just have to go with what you think is best for you dog :)
 

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That is great to hear! Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking the raw diet at all. I think you need to choose to feed your dog what suits you best and only you who's with your dog all day, seeing their general well-being and outlook on life and also their condition can make that judgement.
As above, my comment only refers to what my trainer has said to me and I've heard echoed a few times that basically the domestic dog is a far cry from its wild ancestors so they don't have such a need to be fed raw meat and bones. As I say, my old dog would have terrible diarrhoea if I ever fed her any raw meat or cooked yet she would enjoy a hambone with all the raw meat on and suffered no ill effects?
You just have to go with what you think is best for you dog :)
No your not but all im saying is you never know long term what type of diet will suit your dog best.Now please dont jump down my throat here but @Dawnben was just saying there are better foods then what your feeding your dog. Now dont take this the wrong way and im not trying to tell you what to do but when i was new to this forum i had a similar experience members telling me the food im feeding isnt a good one and to get my dogs off it. Trouble was where i live we were so limited 2.5 years ago but now we have better healthier foods in New Zealand.

I felt a bit like you i thought the food i was feeding was a good food but then i asked what they meant by not a good food and fillers and since then have learnt from the members here an awful lot and my lab who was on royal canin nuetered mature (nz version) well he got to point he stank and was miserable( i know your dog isnt like this) i then found a better food now fresh senior which had just come out 2 years ago here and then one day he didnt do well on it anymore.

I then tried a few foods with him and put him on acana light and fit which he thrives on and is losing weight on (11 year old very very arthritic dog)

Like you say its all about whats best for the dog and you can afford. See how the dog goes on the food long term and go from there and if / when you want to put your dog on a better food we are here to help

Thought be good to share my experience end of day we only care and want to help members on here old or new that doesnt matter and we care about the dogs health and nutrition too that is all it is.
 
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oh and @Yorkienovice17 there are worse foods then what your feeding that contain colorants which can cause seizures in dogs with basically no meat eg purina beneful so although im no fan of royal canin ingredients its not the worst out there like some ive seen! you could of picked an even worse food but you didnt so well done! if its any consolation my little dog in my avatar was one eukanuba then purina tux then optimum (australian brand) so yes i fed the worst foods possibly regretfully but i have come a long way and at last sorted out my dogs allergies and intolerances, urine problems esp the PH , cystitis etc and she is healthy now and thats all that matters is that we do the best for our dogs.

Id also go with others suggestions to feed twice a day
 

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Discussion Starter #19
That is great to hear! Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking the raw diet at all. I think you need to choose to feed your dog what suits you best and only you who's with your dog all day, seeing their general well-being and outlook on life and also their condition can make that judgement.
As above, my comment only refers to what my trainer has said to me and I've heard echoed a few times that basically the domestic dog is a far cry from its wild ancestors so they don't have such a need to be fed raw meat and bones. As I say, my old dog would have terrible diarrhoea if I ever fed her any raw meat or cooked yet she would enjoy a hambone with all the raw meat on and suffered no ill effects?
You just have to go with what you think is best for you dog
No your not but all im saying is you never know long term what type of diet will suit your dog best.Now please dont jump down my throat here but @Dawnben was just saying there are better foods then what your feeding your dog. Now dont take this the wrong way and im not trying to tell you what to do but when i was new to this forum i had a similar experience members telling me the food im feeding isnt a good one and to get my dogs off it. Trouble was where i live we were so limited 2.5 years ago but now we have better healthier foods in New Zealand.

I felt a bit like you i thought the food i was feeding was a good food but then i asked what they meant by not a good food and fillers and since then have learnt from the members here an awful lot and my lab who was on royal canin nuetered mature (nz version) well he got to point he stank and was miserable( i know your dog isnt like this) i then found a better food now fresh senior which had just come out 2 years ago here and then one day he didnt do well on it anymore.

I then tried a few foods with him and put him on acana light and fit which he thrives on and is losing weight on (11 year old very very arthritic dog)

Like you say its all about whats best for the dog and you can afford. See how the dog goes on the food long term and go from there and if / when you want to put your dog on a better food we are here to help

Thought be good to share my experience end of day we only care and want to help members on here old or new that doesnt matter and we care about the dogs health and nutrition too that is all it is.
No I totally understand that and I'm fully aware that his tastes and what he needs from his food may change as he gets older. I don't mind people suggesting better quality food and I'm more than happy to receive that information and knowledge.
My only issue was the fact that the comment wasnt very helpful and quite critical when it wasn't actually asked for. Has she written in a nice way or possibly sent me a private message just to advise and give me some examples or ways to improve, I would've been happy to hear it. However, just commenting to criticise my choice of dog food without providing any information or alternatives isn't really helpful and it just seems like a nasty comment to make in my opinion.
However, an in-depth, informative response such as yourself will certainly encourage me to start looking into my choice of dog food more.
I am always cautious though as with my previous dog, I took a lot of advice from people on forums who claimed they were knowledgeable and I ended up creating a complete wreck of the dog. To be honest, as long as my Vet and trainer are happy with my choice of dog food for my dog then I'm happy to stick with it but if they have a recommended something different I would consider that in the future.
 

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I do definitely agree with you, my old York he was very much just fed little and often throughout the day and left a long happy life. I did originally start feeding Teddy one meal in the morning which was left down and then a fresh dish in the evening but my trainer told me that it can encourage a dog to become fussy and also they see themselves as the alpha male because they don't naturally graze on food.
Of course, I do not want to be wasting food by just leaving it down all day and I do not want to create a fussy dog but nor do I want him to stuff himself because he thinks it will be hours until his next meal.
The feedback that I got from the vet at his last checkup is that while he isn't actually overweight, he certainly has plenty on him. She did advise that that is a normal thing for a puppy so I don't think he is lacking in his food but he's on the lowest weight/feed ratio a Yorkshire terrier can be. I think I'm going to slightly decreased the daily allowance and do it in two feeds and see how we goes. I may also go back to leaving it down all day as well as I can understand a little dog of his size may not have the capacity to wolf down a large meal in one go like a big dog. Nor do I want to encourage him to bolt his food down and become food aggressive because he doesn't know when the next meal is coming
Your trainer is wrong. leaving food down for your dog all day does not cause him to view himself as alpha. Nor will eating before you, going through doors before you, or any number of things that those who believe that dogs seek to be alpha may decide to come up with. http://www.dogforum.com/training-behavior-stickies/dominance-dogs-4076/

Leaving food down for him to eat when he likes will not make him a fussy eater. To accomplish that you'd need to start changing foods every time he decided he was tired of what he's currently eating, or giving in and feeding treats or people food when he won't eat his kibble. When leaving it down may become a problem is if you ever get another dog and the dogs start bickering over the food bowl, or one speed eats and the other grazes, if the last happens the speed eater generally will eat his food then go help finish the other dogs food.

If your pup does fine on 2 feedings a day then feed him like that, there's nothing wrong with it. If he starts getting hunger pukes due to his stomach being empty then try feeding him a small meal around the half way point between the meals. My dog is fed one meal in the morning, then treats or a snack during the day, then he's fed dinner, and last thing at night he's fed a small meal. The treats are because we train during our daily walk, if we don't use his treat allotment on the walk then I mix them with a bit of food and put it in one of his food puzzles. The small meal last thing at night is because he will get hunger pukes sometime after 4am if he doesn't get it and I do not enjoy getting up first thing in the morning to clean throw up off my floor.
 
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