[xochdv]

Hello! I am new to the group, joined because I want to discuss something with fellow dog lovers. I have worked at a doggy daycare, vet office, dog walking, fostered, volunteered, if it has to do with dogs I have done it pretty much. Do to COVID 19 I am out of a job but still have a steady income so I figured now would be the best time to adopt a puppy. I have been wanting to do this for about 2 years but never could for various reasons. I want a puppy for a number of reasons that I won't delve into right now. I have been searching shelters and rescues for over a month and have found no puppies that are compatible with me or my current dog. I so deeply want to rescue but it seems that shelters and rescues have no young dogs. I decided to try out craigslist out of curiosity and found some puppies so I decided to at least go and visit them. I fell in love with one of them. The people adopting him out are a very low income family that had an accidental litter. The woman was very open with me and explained that her family is very low on money and have not been able to afford a spay/neuter surgery and felt really bad. My gut feeling was that she was being honest b/c she asked about my living situation and told me I had to wait until they were old enough to take home. She even held him for me over other people because she saw that I would give him a good home. I don't get the impression she is a backyard breeder but I still feel incredibly guilty adopting from craigslist over a shelter or rescue. She also mentioned that a lot of possible dog fighters have contacted her and I'm worried that since she's not a professional she won't be able to tell who is or isn't. Do you think there are situations in which getting a pup from craigslist can be a way of rescuing?

 

[dogslife]

The dog doesn't care how you found it.

 

[JoanneF]

I agree with @dogslife, the dog doesn't care.

However. Do remember that puppy farmers and unscrupulous back yard breeders can be very plausible.

You saw mum, I take it - had she definitely just given birth, were her teats obviously producing milk (ie she wasn't a false mum, with the real mum in a cage in a barn somewhere, which is a ruse often used to fool buyers that they aren'tbuying from puppy farmers). Could the owner show you photos of mum with the owner and her own family in different seasons?

Was the owner able to explain the circumstances of the accidental mating? How did it happen during lockdown when two dogs shouldn't have been out (to be fair, I'm not sure of the dates in the US but it might be a question)?

The huge red flag for me is that she was contacted by ”possible dog fighters”. These purchasers are equally plausible, no way are they going to tell her that was their intention. I'd put money on it that she told you that to pressure you into ”saving” a puppy from that.

This is a UK link but the info in it is equally valid.

What Does a Puppy Farm REALLY Look Like? Could YOU tell?

Puppies bought from puppy farms are more likely to develop illnesses and have long-term problems with their behaviour later in life.

www.pdsa.org.uk

I'm not saying don't go ahead, but just be aware they may not be as genuine as you hope.

 

[xochdv]

I agree with @dogslife, the dog doesn't care.

However. Do remember that puppy farmers and unscrupulous back yard breeders can be very plausible.

You saw mum, I take it - had she definitely just given birth, were her teats obviously producing milk (ie she wasn't a false mum, with the real mum in a cage in a barn somewhere, which is a ruse often used to fool buyers that they aren'tbuying from puppy farmers). Could the owner show you photos of mum with the owner and her own family in different seasons?

Was the owner able to explain the circumstances of the accidental mating? How did it happen during lockdown when two dogs shouldn't have been out (to be fair, I'm not sure of the dates in the US but it might be a question)?

The huge red flag for me is that she was contacted by ”possible dog fighters”. These purchasers are equally plausible, no way are they going to tell her that was their intention. I'd put money on it that she told you that to pressure you into ”saving” a puppy from that.

This is a UK link but the info in it is equally valid.

What Does a Puppy Farm REALLY Look Like? Could YOU tell?

Puppies bought from puppy farms are more likely to develop illnesses and have long-term problems with their behaviour later in life.

www.pdsa.org.uk

I'm not saying don't go ahead, but just be aware they may not be as genuine as you hope.

I did see the mom. She had very clearly just given birth, she was very emaciated because of it (the owner was saving money to get her to a vet for a check up and spay) but incredibly friendly and alert. They own both the mom and dad that is how they were able to mate. She told me they usually can just monitor the female's heat to keep them from mating but this time they missed it. She was concerned about dog fighters b/c they would contact her and ask for the whole litter which she found odd, but that is a fair point and I'll look into that. In my area it's been impossible to find a puppy anywhere b/c they are in such high demand and she has held the puppy for me against other offers. My gut tells me she's being honest but what you bring up is what I fear. I want to save dog not support irresponsible breeding. It's a very hard decision. Thank you for your input

 

[JoanneF]

Are the male and female the same breed?

I'm not sure how Craigslist works, are you able to scan back through her old expired adverts to see if this has happened before?

She may be totally genuine, I'm just a suspicious person.

 

[xochdv]

Are the male and female the same breed?

I'm not sure how Craigslist works, are you able to scan back through her old expired adverts to see if this has happened before?

She may be totally genuine, I'm just a suspicious person.

They are not. The father is a shepherd mix of some sort and the mom is a pitbull mix. I'll have to check that out but I don't think so. She did say it happened once before.

 

[JoanneF]

Hmm.

Pity she didn't use some of the income from the first litter to neuter one of the dogs.

There are accidental matings but there is no need for accidental litters - the Alizin jab is pretty cheap.

At the end of it, it's absolutely your choice. Maybe I am just over-cautious, i hope she is genuine. Whether you believe her or not, as Dogslife says, the puppy won't care.

 

[Mad Murphy]

OK accidents happen once after that its carelessness or BYB. But the puppy wont care.

I got Murphy from an ad site here I guess it must be like craigslist its where adverts for everything from tea services to holiday homes get listed by private individuals.

However I did check out the breeder before I even went to see her. Once I had her name and adress I checked to see if she was a known BYB , if she had an county court judgements against her (wanted to check for dishonesty and BYB or cruelty) and then I checked out her home area for other signs of puppy farming.

She and her husband and their adress was clear of any red flags so I went to see her and she was very honest showed me all the paperwork for her dogs explained it had been an oops litter (dad was too young) but he had been de-sexed since the mating occured so that it wouldnt happen again.

My pup came at 8 weeks responding to his name because she had called him by name every time he was fed or touched and he was fully housetrained ..I know that sounds impossible but its true this lady had been home all the time and had devoted herself to raising as near perfect pups as she could for the new owners to take home,

She was very nice and Ive kept in touch , true to her word there are no more litters her dogs are still with her and she has no intention of ever breeding again. So not everyone on these sites is bad but you do have to be very careful.

 

[Sunflower_]

She could be honest but at the same time not. What’s a warning flag for me is that she have had an accidental litter before this. Once is one thing but if it happens continuously, they need to start to taking more responsibility.

Even though it might not be intentionally, it’s still not okay. And if you by accident support an organized Backyardbreeder, that’s for sure isn’t good. What’s the price of the puppies? Have they been vaccinated? What does the mother look like? Does it look like she’ve had a lot of puppies? Can you do some sort of research on the person? Is the ad still up? Could you link it? (If that’s not against the rules)

 

[JoanneF]

I dont think it breaches the rules.

 

[xochdv]

She could be honest but at the same time not. What’s a warning flag for me is that she have had an accidental litter before this. Once is one thing but if it happens continuously, they need to start to taking more responsibility.

Even though it might not be intentionally, it’s still not okay. And if you by accident support an organized Backyardbreeder, that’s for sure isn’t good. What’s the price of the puppies? Have they been vaccinated? What does the mother look like? Does it look like she’ve had a lot of puppies? Can you do some sort of research on the person? Is the ad still up? Could you link it? (If that’s not against the rules)

It is hard to explain a lot of this because of a matter of culture. She is Mexican, her family are immigrants and work in the fields which in America right now is a terrible and underpaid job. As I mentioned before it is very clear that they don't have much money. The puppies are not vaccinated but again I think that has to do with lack of information and money rather than lack of care.
Here is the post Mixed pit bull puppies - pets

 

[Sunflower_]

Could you talk to them and ask them to neuter one of the dogs for the money they’ll get from the puppies? I’m not the person to suggest neutering as the solution, but in this case it feels necessary. Their response to you asking that could also show if they’re being genuine or not. Because even though the puppies are cheap, they will profit from this, since they haven’t invested any money in the puppies (health tests, vet visits, registrations, chip, vaccinations etc). I understand that it’s crucial to put a price on the puppies, but the issue is that they will earn money on the dogs even though it’s very poor breeding (intentionally or not). This can be a reason to continue to breed, it’s easy money. So ask them if they will neuter one of the dogs with the money from the puppies.

 

[xochdv]

Could you talk to them and ask them to neuter one of the dogs for the money they’ll get from the puppies? I’m not the person to suggest neutering as the solution, but in this case it feels necessary. Their response to you asking that could also show if they’re being genuine or not. Because even though the puppies are cheap, they will profit from this, since they haven’t invested any money in the puppies (health tests, vet visits, registrations, chip, vaccinations etc). I understand that it’s crucial to put a price on the puppies, but the issue is that they will earn money on the dogs even though it’s very poor breeding (intentionally or not). This can be a reason to continue to breed, it’s easy money. So ask them if they will neuter one of the dogs with the money from the puppies.

Yeah that was my same thought. I messaged asking why the price was what it was. The mom dog is in poor health so if she answers that it for that and surgery then i will feel more comfortable over all

 

[JoanneF]

If the mother is in poor health, are you sure the puppies are ok? It would be heartbreaking as well as expensive to get one that was unwell and needed a lot of treatment.

 

[xochdv]

If the mother is in poor health, are you sure the puppies are ok? It would be heartbreaking as well as expensive to get one that was unwell and needed a lot of treatment.

She is very emaciated b/c of the puppies. Aside from that she seems very happy, just needs to gain some weight from the loss of nutrients. The puppies seemed in good health and very sweet. I was actually mostly attracted to the pup because both the mom and dad had great temperaments which is important to me.

 

[SusanLynn]

The wording in that ad sounds like every other Craigslist ad for puppies being sold by BYBers. It's a definite red flag for me

Would it be possible to adopt a puppy from a legitimate rescue group instead?

 

[xochdv]

The wording in that ad sounds like every other Craigslist ad for puppies being sold by BYBers. It's a definite red flag for me

Would it be possible to adopt a puppy from a legitimate rescue group instead?

I decided not to get the puppy. It is but nearly impossible. I'm pretty sad but I'll have to keep looking. Rescues can be so strict to where they push people to buy from breeders instead. They either charge like $500-$800 adoption fee or insanely strict requirements.

 

[SusanLynn]

May I ask which part of the country you're located in? Also, are you only looking for a puppy?

 

[xochdv]

May I ask which part of the country you're located in? Also, are you only looking for a puppy?

I’m in California. I would prefer a puppy. I’ve had my dog for 11 years and got him as an adult and i love him to death but i always wish I could’ve known him as a puppy. I have worked with a lot of dogs and know what I want but mostly I want a dog I connect with. I have my heart set on some sort of shepherd mix but most rescues are even more picky with those breeds

 

[xochdv]

I completly agree about rescues. Sadly I will never adopt from a shelter because they will never give me one. Here they are incredibly judgemental.
This is just my input. If your gut is strongly saying that puppys calling you to be its mother then i would get it.

I already missed out on that puppy and it’s ok. I wouldn’t want to feel any regret when I finally find my new baby. It’s a bummer b/c money isn’t the only thing that makes a good pet parent. I’ve been through hell and back with my current guy and he’s the most loved dog ever