Best site for finding a dog?

There are loads of Beagles for adoption in private Beagle rescues, such as Beagle Freedom Project, and many southern states have small hound dog mixes. A Basset might suit you as a low energy dog but they are larger. And if you want a dog that is calm then it's actually best TO get an adult dog. That doesn't mean a senior but one 2-5 years old.

I also agree petfinder is one of the best sites. And you can google Beagle and Cavalier (or other desirable breed) rescues in your area. You might even look into finding a shelter that allows you to put an alert or hold on a small breed, younger dog. Small breed dogs get adopted VERY fast. I worked in a shelter and some would literally get adopted within 5 minutes of being put on the floor. There ARE most definitely dogs that fit what you want, but you just need to look a bit harder than if you wanted a larger dog.

John Howard said:

How much trust should I put in the breed classification that is listed on petfinder.com dogs. I mean some of the look good but some are like, "What"

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Eh, take it with a grain of salt. Some people at shelters are not very good at classifying the breeds. Some want to make the dog sound exotic or less common (or less like an "undesirable" breed like a Pit Bull) and more adoptable, so they call it something else. Some are really common "alternatives" to certain breeds. For example if you put in "Dalmatian" you'll get a lot of Pit Bull mixes with spots that come up! Also, even for dog experts, sometimes exact breeds are difficult to pin down in dogs. Those are often called "Heinz 57" or "could be anythings"! So when they're listed online they just say whatever the dog sort of looks like, and it can be very hit or miss.

Hm...That dog looks to me like a Pug mixed with something larger. Maybe with a Boxer or random Mutt. What's it say?

And just curious but what's making you shy away from Beagles? Usually people don't like their barks or shedding, but I like them better than Cocker Spaniels. Everyone's different, but I've seen plenty of Cockers or Cocker mixes in shelters and rescues too.

John Howard said:

As far as beagles go, I have never owned one and just like the way they look. I finally got a call back from a shelter yesterday (only one), and the lady seemed very knowledgeable about dogs and told me that Beagles have a higher BITE average then most other dogs according to bite statistics (she said I could find this somewhere online). Well, with grandchildren and 36 great-nieces and nephews that come visit me, I cannot have a dog that will bite.

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This is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard said about Beagles. Aside from bite statistics being the most unreliable stats I can think of, Beagles are good natured, tolerant dogs. For goodness sake the main reason they're tortured in scientific experiments is because they're so sweet they're less likely than other breeds to attack their abusers. Any breed of dog can bite, but by breed generalization, I would pick a Beagle to be around children over many others. However yes, Dachshunds do have a low tolerance and can be snappy.

Have you considered Poodles or Bichons? They might be good fit. And while the breed is probably not just Pug/Beagle on that dog you posted a photo of (I actually believe those are two big possibilities, but something else must be there for the brindle color), what was that dog like? Pugs are small and typically good family dogs as well. Shih Tzus are nice as well. You will also expand your choices if your wife opens herself up to the possibility of a male dog. I don't know if she's scared of marking or what, but gender usually doesn't have much differences, especially when they're neutered.

And yes, some shelters and rescues have very poor people skills and are so strict with their adoption policies that they scare people away. Just keep trying, unless you have the money to buy a purebred from a good breeder. Just don't go to a pet store or get one online!

You said you're a grandad so obviously you're older. I'm sure years ago you went to a pound or store said 'I want that dog' paid the fee and left. In plenty of places you can still do that. But...those places generally don't give a sh*t about their animals, or the people adopting them.

All this rescue is saying is they need to make sure you're a nice person who can afford the dog and isn't lying to them. Which happens--a lot! Not only that but as you said there's requirements you have like the dog that's good with kids. In the event you picked out a dog that seemed great but hated kids and bit one, you would be pretty upset, a kid would be hurt and the dog would be without a home. This rescue's procedure seems rather simple and if you ARE a responsible person who is telling the truth, they should be able to find a dog to suit you. I think you just need to chill out about the procedures. Without it people and animals are at risk.

I'm glad you finally found a dog and hope we can hear more about her when you bring her home. And where did you eventually find a place to get the dog?

However I really don't understand how or why you keep bringing up abortion because regardless of your views on that, the two have absolutely nothing to do with each other. It's not even like you're comparing adopting a child to a dog. They're two entirely different things with quite frankly, opposite goals in mind.

I'm not going to argue your views on abortion but I am going to argue your views on standard adoption procedures being "insulting" to the humans. What is so bad about meeting their standards for getting one of their dogs? That means they CARE about the dogs. Usually the standards aren't too high either. You have to be a nice person, have the money, means and time to care for the dog, a vet in mind, and have a lifestyle that meshes with a particular dog. It's not hard for the majority of people to pass this. If you work in animal rescue you will see animals come to you abused, abandoned, neglected, badly trained/trained to attack, with health problems, and all sorts of horrible, preventable problems that HUMANS caused. Quite frankly, plenty of people are not fit to own dogs, or want them for purposes that are not safe for the animals, and occasionally not safe for the public as well. The alternative to this is saying "Oh, you want one of our dogs? Pick any one you want!" That will mean dogs that hate kids will go to homes with kids and bite them and be declared "vicious", dogs who need an experienced owners will go to inexperienced owners who will then call the dogs "unmanageable" and return them or get them put down, people will lie about living in a place that doesn't allow dogs and hide the dog then have to return it 2 months later when the landlord returns, people who want to breed, fight and torture dogs will get them and be allowed to do whatever they want with them. Along with that, many adoption forms are treated like a match-making process. This CAN be a tool to find the "perfect" dog for someone, which really, makes everyone happy. It's truly much more like getting a date on eharmony, while picking any random dog is like a blind date.

These are all situations I have seen, and heard of in my life. This is what *REALLY* happens when people give away or sell dogs without making sure the dog fits with that person's life. Again, if it is not done people and dogs get hurt, and dogs will get returned to the shelter. I don't really care how many people are "insulted" by a very standard procedure, because it protects humans and animals. Not only that, but there are certain private rescues with ridiculous standards, like always needing a fenced yard, having a ridiculous number of references, multiple home visits, high fees, and more. This IS excessive, but the Basset rescue you listed was pretty tame--save for the home visit, which I personally find excessive.

I've noticed that everyone who gets upset about a standard adoption process, generally let their ego get in the way of seeing the logic behind this. Typically they think "Well I'M a good person! How dare they ask me anything! How DARE anyone think I'm not suitable for ---?!" The thing is, it's not about *you*. It's not like they're creating this process just for you. They do this to weed out the bad people, people who don't care about the dogs, and those who can't care for them properly. So I hope you can understand why this is necessary.

Okay, I have some answers for you, and also I have to say I'm thoroughly annoyed and quite angered with many things you have said, especially because some are flat out wrong and prejudiced.

First of all, likening this dog to all shelter dogs is ridiculous. Just because you had a bad experience does not mean that many other people--millions, don't have positive ones. Not only that, but you went on and on and on about how you thought good rescues' and shelters' procedures were "insulting" and ridiculous. Well, if you had gone to one of those instead of becoming personally offended by standard responsible procedures, you'd probably have gotten a better dog with a more thorough history and behavior tests. I find it ironic that you were bothered this shelter had a poor history on this dog yet you find anyone questioning people coming in or out to be a violation. A shelter that asks a lot of questions does so because they would know their animals well and would know how they behave around small dogs/pets and children better than this one did. Just the fact that they adopted out a 6 week old puppy is a huge red flag. That's entirely too young. In fact, puppies separated from their litter before 8 weeks can often have a very strong bite--because they didn't learn better bite inhibition from the other puppies. That might be part of why Gus was like that.

Also, no, it is NOT uncommon for a good number of large dogs to see small dogs as prey. Just because you haven't seen it in anything else than that traumatic attack on your dog doesn't mean that it doesn't happen a lot. If a big dog isn't well socialized to small dogs, and/or they have a high prey drive--which Gus clearly did, then they will probably go after and kill them if they have the chance. I'm concerned too and curious about how you were/were planning to train him with little dogs. Because if you put him in the same room with them right away it likely just riled him up more and made him want to go at them more. Like putting a Redbone in a room with a caged raccoon.

And he "must have some Pit Bull in him"? REALLY?! HOW is it people justify a dog's aggression by saying "Well it must be a Pit Bull!" instead of facing the fact any breed can be dangerous or aggressive?! That maybe it was his experiences or brain wiring that made him act in such a way? This logic is absolutely insane. Believe it or not Labs are responsible for many attacks on children. Not only that, but thinking that a breed makes a dog either dangerous or safe is one of THE most dangerous things that the American public believes. People will assume that a Pit Bull who has a therapy dog certification might one day snap and kill because it's a "vicious" breed. People will assume (like you did) that because something Labs can't be very aggressive, because it's a "friendly" breed. Different breeds have some personality predispositions, but all dogs need to be looked at individually. The dog you got was unstable, reactive to children and small animals, with a high prey drive and poor bite inhibition. His breed (like many dangerous dogs) likely had very little to do with that. And really, him being in a shelter probably had nothing to do with it either. After all, he was there for what, a month? I'm pretty sure whoever had him for the previous 7 months is who created or exacerbated his bad behavior.

You did not go to a responsible rescue. You went to one that fit your standards of "respecting you" and giving you whichever dog you thought "seemed nice" instead of answering and asking a lot of questions to find a dog that IS actually nice and won't go after small dogs and children. So no, you can't blame us for any advice we gave you because you didn't actually follow it.

To end my rant here, I am sorry that you went through such a bad experience and that poor Butch went through this too. But do not try to place any blame on the entire shelter world or a breed that has absolutely no involvement in this at all. This was all due to human irresponsibility, and what sounds like a very unbalanced, reactive dog.

Of course there's more messed up dogs in the USA than other countries. We breed them in such a way that we just breed for looks and not personality so plenty end up screwed in the head. You may be a well traveled, talented linguist but that doesn't make you an expert on dogs, dog breeds, or behavior. Everyone can have their "own opinion", but their education and experiences vary greatly. You're going to take an opinion on medical advice from a nurse much more seriously than someone without medical training. Considering I and many other people on this website have much more dog experience--as trainers, shelter workers, daycare workers, walkers, groomers, breeders, etc., then our opinion is actually more valid than an average person's.

Again, it doesn't matter what your experiences are in terms of large dogs not going after small ones. The part of the "Pit Bull" breed many people forget to leave out is the last part--Terrier. Have you ever seen a terrier tear up rodents? It's a sight to see. They are relentless, tenacious and very efficient killers with a sky high prey drive. Make a terrier twice as large and more muscular and it will possibly see its prey, not just as very small rodents, but larger animals like cats and small dogs as well. And even if you did not directly say Gus must've had some Pit Bull in him, you said that you didn't see any in him, which clearly baffled you because it would've made sense in your head if he looked it. So that logic is very clearly vicious behavior = Pit Bull behavior.

Is it true that bully breeds attack many people? Yes, and that's for a few reasons. First of all, they're the #1 choice for poor dog owners and one of THE most common breeds in the entire country. They're the most abused and neglected breeds of dog there are. If you take a strong dog with no socialization, bad experiences, poor or dangerous training and a high prey drive and then treat it like crap and put it in situations that stress dogs out, bad things will happen. Are there also a good number that are bred to kill and already live casualties of dog fighting that need to be put down? Sadly, yes.

I have to say I've never heard anyone say it's German Shepherds attacking people instead of Pits. But in terms of a Pit being able to kill "Easier than other breeds", well that depends on what you mean. Is the Chihuahua/other small dog vs. a Pit Bull aggression argument that valid? No, not really. The ability to kill and inflict more damage than breeds of smaller size? Yes, of course that's obvious. But dogs of similar build and size, no. Speaking of German Shepherds, they actually have a more powerful bite than bully breed mixes or Pits, as do Rottweilers. That *IS* a fact there have been studies on, not an opinions. So no, your opinion doesn't matter because it's wrong and probably just taken as assumptions you've heard from the media. There's a lot of BS rumors around that their jaws "lock" on prey or they "cause more damage" than other breeds. No they don't. Not in comparison to dogs of similar size/strength. Pretty much all dogs over 50-60 lbs have the capacity to kill an adult human. Most dogs have the capacity to kill children. Dogs are a predator species, and their bodies and anatomy is still made to kill prey. Do owners of large dogs have to bear more responsibility than that of a small dog? Hell yes. But placing all the blame on Pit Bulls or bully breeds is just a jerk thing to do.

That's it, I'm done.

Ok, in your experience getting a shelter dog is riskier than getting one from a previous owner. That's not always the case because people often lie. In shelters, they ask questions to the surrendering owner but have to still test the dog because again, people will lie because they are worried people won't want a dog with problems. And no, you are wrong again. Plenty of people reject dogs with no or few problems. Some of the biggest reasons dogs are in shelters is because their owners are moving, they affected someone's allergies, they were born to a stray/unwanted dog, they themselves were a stray,by heir owners die/get ill/go into a nursing home, they were given to someone who did not want them, people 'lose interest', and because they get abused and are removed by the police. Are dogs turned in for health and behavior issues? YES. But at least half--probably more dogs are turned into shelters through no fault of their own. And plenty of their behavior issues are just wrong homes. A 'crazy' or bad Border Collie in the suburbs with small kids may be perfection working sheep on a farm. It may feel like 'common sense' says dogs aren't rejected without reason. But it may be common sense all parents love their kids. Neither thing is true, because it's not based on common sense but rather common decency--which most people don't have. I have been involved in the shelter world since I was 12 and have read, researched, experienced and learned all of this. So I do know what I'm talking about.

You may say no one needs to tell you what you need and that your family ultimately made this poor choice. Fair point. But after this bad situation can you not see the need for screening potential adopters and matching dogs with proper homes? People a shelters aren't really concerned with your needs--they're concerned with the animal's needs. In finding out your lifestyle, what you want from the dog and your experiences, they can find the proper home for each dog. When that doesn't happen dogs get returned--which is exactly what happened to you!

I do not think I'm more intelligent than you. (Although you should learn the proper usage of then/than). However I do think that you consider your intelligence and wealth of life experiences to make you skilled in arenas you are not skilled in. I may not be smarter than you but I know more about dogs and shelters, and that's what this question was about.

Quite frankly your chickens have nothing to do with this. I don't even understand why you're bringing them up because chickens and dogs are drastically different animals that are kept for different purposes, and there aren't millions of homeless chickens waiting for a home, nor ridiculous numbers of people breeding chickens as pets. Yes, it's often great to get a dog from a skilled and ethical breeder but again, that's not the point.