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Baby Pittie Being Attacked by Old(er) Yorkshire Terrier

706 views 3 replies 3 participants last post by  AthenaLove 
#1 ·
I will warn you - this will be long.

I have just adopted a Pit Bull/American Bulldog mix puppy (Finn). It's been three weeks now and he is a joy. I've not had a puppy in about twelve years.

I've brought him into my home where there are two twelve year old dogs I rescued twelve years ago. They are tiny. One is a Yorkshire Terrier male (Jackson)n and the other is a Maltese/Poodle mix (Stankin' Ho). They get along swell.

Jackson was insane when I got him. He'd been abused by a child and had his leg broken in many places, requiring pins. He, at the time, came into my home when I had just one other dog, a Yorkie named Puck (my sweet, sweet boy). So things went kind of okay - there were the scuffles and fights at first and were always instigated by Jackson. They eventually died down after a couple of months. I then brought Stankin' into my home and there was only one fight - the first night she was home - he pinned her and she submitted. It was over with. They've only had two or three scuffles in the years since - and there's never any warning sign - Jackson just attacks.

So, I knew going in that I wanted a Pittie pup because I've fallen in love with the three my sister adopted. I also knew that I would have to get a puppy so that it would grow up knowing the two tiny dogs were boss and he would learn his limits with them. I prepared for and expected a dominance fight and watched and waited very closely. I thought it would be like when I brought Stankin' home - one fight to establish dominance and it would be over.

It's not over.

I'm almost in tears because Jackson won't stop attacking Finn. Finn is a puppy and just wants to play. However, he is already fifteen pounds at twelve weeks old. He plays properly - flirting, play posture, etc. He has been pinned by Jackson twice and rolled over to show his belly and he was yelping. I, of course, broke it up as soon as it happened. I scolded Jackson mildly ("not nice! don't be mean") and even tried to reason with him (yeah, I know, but I'm desperate).

I thought things were getting better because they will touch butts when sleeping. Also, when they are both on the floor Jackson will sniff Finn's butt and penis. There is no food aggression or hoarding or anything. There is toy "jealousy". But they've even played tug once.

Just twenty minutes ago Jackson, Stankin', and I were on the chair and Finn was wanting up. He had his front paws on the chair. He's not yet learned how to jump up. Jackson, out of nowhere, attacked him and latched on to Finn's ear or lip (couldn't tell) and wouldn't let go. I had to pry my finger in his mouth to get him to release.

It seems that when they are on equal footing there is no aggression, or at least attacking. But when Jackson is physically higher than Finn it is a problem.

The dogs sleep with me and are at my side constantly. Stankin' growls at him and barks but it's not aggressive - it's more like "I'm a lady and do not care for you, you scurrilous curr." and Finn thinks she is playing.

I want to let Finn be a puppy! I also want Jackson's golden years to be stress free and happy.

I don't know what to do.

Do I a) Train Finn to ignore Jackson and Stankin' somehow? or b) Try to correct and train a 12 year old insane Yorkie to ignore Finn? Is there something in between? Something I'm not thinking of?

Finn gets **lots** and lots of exercise as I take him to my mama and daddy's on the days I work where he plays all day long with their Scottish Terrier and fifteen pound mutt.

I've not been able to take Finn outside yet because he had only received three parvo boosters - tomorrow he will be able to go outside with me.

He's a smart, smart baby. He already poops and pees on the pads, sits on command, and answers to his name and "come", and he also walks on the leash very well!

Please help me.
 
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#2 ·
It sounds like you're working with a bit of a misconception on the concept of dominance in dogs.

There is a very common misconception, rooted in some early studies on wolf behavior done in the 1940's, that details dominance as you're describing it. A linear, unchanging heirarchy established through force, when one dog pins another and makes them submit. The dominant dog is then in charge of all social interaction from that point forwards, unless it is challenged by the previously dominant dog. There is some truth to this model in captive wolf packs, which display highly modified social interaction compared to wild packs. This is not a model that translates well to the domestic dog.

Dominance is actually a much more nuanced concept than just alpha/submissive. For one, it is mostly a term used to describe access to resources. A dog is dominant over another in one situation, with one resource. It is not necessarily a linear hierarchy, but rather a relationship between two individuals. In modern studies done looking at dominance relationships in groups of dogs, the heirarchies they have been able to make look like webs more than a straight line, and usually only encompass 2-5 dogs out of a 10-15 dog group. It is also a fluid, not fixed, construct. One day a dog may feel compelled to guard a resource that yesterday it did not, and the dog it is being guarded from may not be motivated as highly to negotiate for that resource in every situation.

Healthy dominance relationships are established mostly through ritualized displays, not through agonistic interactions. It is the submitting dog that determines the dominance relationship. In a healthy interaction, there is no actual contact made. The discussion over who gets a resource is done through ritualized posturing.

This article might be a good read: https://drsophiayin.com/philosophy/dominance/

It sounds like your entire expectation of how these dogs would coexist was built around the assumption that they would have one knock-down fight and then a social relationship would be set into stone. While that may have been how your older dog's relationship transpired, that isn't normal dog-dog social behavior.

From the sound of it, you have 2 elderly small dogs who are sometimes OK with the puppy, but not really a fan of his presence. They both sound to have their own insecurities, and to like their personal space from the puppy.

You don't mention how old the puppy is or what kind of training you plan to/have been doing to with him? I'm assuming he's somewhere between 10-14 weeks given the shots record you reported. I would definitely be crate training, and also use an X-pen so he can be part of the action while still being separated from it and unable to bother the adult dogs. My feeling is that the senior dogs would also probably benefit from learning some independence. Starting by trying to teach them to relax behind a baby gate would be a good idea.

Also keep in mind that bully breeds do tend to be very physical players, and can be extremely high energy dogs, especially during adolescence. That's not a guarentee, as there's very little set "type" in personality in them, but it is always a thought I have when someone has a very young puppy that is likely to change radically in behavior as it matures.

Unfortunately, bringing a puppy in to the house has guaranteed some level of controlled chaos. I would be focusing your energy on:
(1) managing and train the puppy to ensure he is learning appropriate behavior with the smaller adult dogs
(2) ensuring that the adult dogs get ample puppy free time
(3) teaching the adult dogs how to peacefully coexist with the puppy
 
#4 ·
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Unfortunately, bringing a puppy in to the house has guaranteed some level of controlled chaos. I would be focusing your energy on:
(1) managing and train the puppy to ensure he is learning appropriate behavior with the smaller adult dogs
(2) ensuring that the adult dogs get ample puppy free time
(3) teaching the adult dogs how to peacefully coexist with the puppy
Very good advice here!
 
#3 · (Edited)
Thank you and well said @Moonstream. I feel like there is so much misinformation and outdated thinking when it comes to the term dominance and dog. People tend to use the word so frequently and loosely and sometimes it makes finding a solution harder and slower bc many dog issues are being misdiagnosed.

I, too, have an older small dog and a younger strong puppy.Now 15lbs vs 54 lbs. I made it of UTMOST importance to teach the young pup to play gentle with the older little dog. And to be gentle around him and other dogs and humans. And I ask for polite and respectful manners between all three of my dogs to each other. No one is top dog. All get jobs. All get ample rewards. All get time with me and also time alone to relax so that they learn that being alone is ok, too. I teach relax to them-- and we do lots of relaxing massage as well. It is all about keeping stress levels down so that everyone can coexist peacefully. Not so much concerned with dominance, etc --way more focused on the importance of achieving minimal stress in the home for everyone.

I watch all my three dogs body language when they are together. If any dog looks uncomfortable, I immediately intervene and try to relax the dogs. If one can't seem to feel secure in the moment, I simply separate them as needed, generally giving a treat or toy or chewie when I separate them so no one feels punished for being separated. I do not leave them together unattended when I am not home or cannot supervise since they have had some issues prior (due to high stress levels and human error)

I have baby gates in every room/hall so I can quickly and conveniently separate any of my three dogs if needed.

Prevention is key when having dogs with issues and vastly different personalities/ages. Proper management can prevent many poor interactions and keep them from escalating into fights.

And yes, older dogs need time away from annoying rambunctious playful puppies. Lots of time away. SUPER IMPORTANT!!!!!!!!!!!! [/B

]This keeps the stress level down in your home and will help your older dogs to not be stressed...even if the older dogs like or tolerate the puppy.

In my home, I allow my three dogs to show displeasure to each other in a civilized manner, just like I would let a child show a sibling displeasure. But--- I never want fighting between any of them. If one shows teeth or growls at another, I generally asks them what's up, what's going on, and then try to remedy the situation.

I don't choose to punish any of my dogs for growling or warning because I would much rather they learn to appropriately warn another dog(or human) when they are uncomfortable instead of suppressing their stressful feelings... and then lashing out without warning or communication. (bite or fight without giving warning signals)

Many people want to scold their dog for growling but I actually thank my dogs for letting me know something is wrong or stressful--- and then I work through it with my dog.

Great communication and trust are what I am always aiming for with my dogs.
And I want my dogs to live as stress free, serene and happy as possible.
 
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