[kaemaahl]

I have 3 dogs, a female(CiCi) and 2 males (Forrest and Franklin). Forrest and CiCi are the parents of Franklin. About 3 months ago, Franklin had a seizure, upon snapping out of his seizure, he instantly attacked his father for no known reason, harming him in the process. Ever since that day, the dogs are increasingly aggressive to each other. It started as maybe 1 fight every few days, now its up to as many as 6 fights a day between the two. Franklin seems to initiate most fights. Most fights seem to occur when someone enters my house, or someone enters the room they haven't seen or a while (someone in bed asleep, if you will). The fights are getting worse as they go, and I'm starting to be a victim myself, having been attacked by Franklin 3 of the last 4 times I broke them up.

All 3 dogs are Chihuahua/Lhasa Apso mixes. Forrest and Cici have the same father but different mothers. Neither of the males are fixed. I'm getting at wits end here, and as much as I love my fur babies, I'm thinking I may have to get rid of one, which I really don't want to. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[kaemaahl]

Also, I wanna add, that when they aren't fighting, Franklin is the absolute most loving dog I have ever seen in my life. I don't believe his attacks against me are malicious, but more that he's scared.

 

[PoppyKenna]

Did Franklin see a vet after his seizure?

 

[kelly528]

It's likely that Franklin is still suffering from seizures or a related neurological issue. A good first plan of action would be to take him to the vet, especially given the history of neurological problems. I would also consider neutering them. Given Frank's seizures, I think its safe to assume that Forest and Cici might have some faulty genes and need genetic testing if you want to produce healthy puppies.

After you have ruled out medical issues, find a certified behaviorist in your area. Dog fights are nothing to sneeze at and usually the animals need to be seen firsthand by an experienced professional so that their specific triggers can be rooted out and worked on. For the meantime, you can crate and rotate them so that they stay out of each-other's hair.

 

[kaemaahl]

Did Franklin see a vet after his seizure?

No. I'm a single parent of 3 barely getting by. I love my furbabies but I can't afford my own medical bills, let alone bills for my pups. I spent $1,000 last year after Franklin nearly died to parvo, which is odd because we don't let him outside. Since then, I've been in a hole that I can't seem to get out of financially.

 

[kaemaahl]

It's likely that Franklin is still suffering from seizures or a related neurological issue. A good first plan of action would be to take him to the vet, especially given the history of neurological problems. I would also consider neutering them. Given Frank's seizures, I think its safe to assume that Forest and Cici might have some faulty genes and need genetic testing if you want to produce healthy puppies.

After you have ruled out medical issues, find a certified behaviorist in your area. Dog fights are nothing to sneeze at and usually the animals need to be seen firsthand by an experienced professional so that their specific triggers can be rooted out and worked on. For the meantime, you can crate and rotate them so that they stay out of each-other's hair.

I think the seizures stem from my brother's dog, Forrest's father. He is full blooded Lhasa Apso and he has seizures much more often than Franklin does. CiCi also has seizures more often than Franklin, though she didn't start having hers until she was 3 years old.

 

[kelly528]

I'd get your vet's take. Some dog seizures are easy to spot, but seizures take many forms, such as fly biting (snapping at flies that aren't really there), or just zoning out all of a sudden. Sometimes we don't see or notice a seizure happening until the dog snaps out of it, disoriented, upset and on the defensive. With any luck, the vet might be able to see if prescribing an anti-seizure drug doesn't help things.

 

[kelly528]

Reading some of your other information...

Do these dogs ever get outside for walks?
How old are your kids?
And you can't afford vet treatment, spay/neuter?

I hate to say it but you might want to bite the bullet and surrender to a rescue. I don't know your full situation but it seems like you have bitten off more than you can chew here. It would really suck if one of your kids interfered with the fighting dogs and got bitten. If that were to happen, that would pretty much be the end of the line for the dog, as rescues don't usually take dogs with bite histories.

Sorry, but if you can't seek the appropriate vet care, training and make ends meet for yourself and your kids, a rescue may be the most reasonable option here. They are very good about background-checking potential adopters (just ask anyone here who has failed a background check due to an unfenced yard, their age, the number of dogs they already own... they are very nitpicky).

 

[kaemaahl]

Reading some of your other information...

Do these dogs ever get outside for walks?
How old are your kids?
And you can't afford vet treatment, spay/neuter?

I hate to say it but you might want to bite the bullet and surrender to a rescue. I don't know your full situation but it seems like you have bitten off more than you can chew here. It would really suck if one of your kids interfered with the fighting dogs and got bitten. If that were to happen, that would pretty much be the end of the line for the dog, as rescues don't usually take dogs with bite histories.

Sorry, but if you can't seek the appropriate vet care, training and make ends meet for yourself and your kids, a rescue may be the most reasonable option here. They are very good about background-checking potential adopters (just ask anyone here who has failed a background check due to an unfenced yard, their age, the number of dogs they already own... they are very nitpicky).

I can afford to spay/neuter. I can't afford mri's/CT scans, etc. youngest is 15. I'm not dead broke, I get by. I just can't afford to spend hundreds on this, as bad as it sounds.

 

[kelly528]

Hm. An alternate route to go might be simply to go straight to a trainer/behaviorist and have them assessed in your home. For what its worth, it might be something they recognize instantly and know that they can solve. On the other hand, they might throw up their hands and tell you that they see no environmental triggers for Franklin's outbursts. Still, it might be worth a shot. Cheaper than putting Franklin through a battery of tests.

 

[supaflyskye]

You have received good advice here. It would be most responsible to surrender at least one of your dogs. And to have at least one of the remaining dogs spayed/neutered so they don't produce more inbred puppies, that was very irresponsible of you to allow happen.
On that note, its possible your dog is having seizures and is behaving aggressively due to being inbred w/ bad genes.
I stress again, if they are fighting many times a day, you have been bitten multiple times, you cannot afford to care for them properly, it is absolutely imperative that you remove at least one if not more from your house, and have the remaining dog/s spayed/neutered.
I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but it is absolutely the truth.
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Bigargylesock]

Some animal neurology offices have special donation funds set up for those who cannot afford treatment for their pets. It's often based on income level. You could contact either your vet or specialists in the area to see if you can qualify for extra funding.

Also, try contacting any rescue, to see if they have any resources for these things. Sometimes they know of vets/specialists who may be willing to work with clients who are unable to afford treatment.

 

[kmes]

Welcome to the forum.
Sounds like you have quite a bit of stuff to work through here with your dogs...

First, Def look for a good reward based trainer who has working relationships with vets. I think you're going to need both the expertise of a trainer and a vet to make things work. If able to locate and afford veterinary behaviorist could be awesome! These links may help you search for professionals in your area.
http://www.dogforum.com/training-be...ainer-behavior-consultant-behaviorist-113946/
Even if it doesn't work out, it will only help your youngest in the end. As it stands now, he's not going to be easy to rehome and may not be considered adoptable by rescues and shelters...

I would start by getting seizures under control. You do not need to get MRI's and other costly diagnostics in order to start treatment. Meds like phenobarbitol are often effective at controlling seizures and for small dogs, pretty easy on the wallet.

Also alter all of your dogs. Bare minimum start with spaying CiCi (if not already done). The fact that there have been seizures in 3 generations (grandfather, mother, son) is not good.... likely a genetic factor in there...
Hopefully the grandfather (your brother's lhasa) has also been neutered as he really shouldn't be fathering puppies.

In the meantime, separate your dogs. If you want a chance at making it work you need to come up with a management plan so that you do not continue to have these fights. That likely involves some sort or crate and rotate type system. Might actually be crating and rotating who is out with you. Could be giving each dog their own room or space (bedrooms, bathroom, kitchen, etc.) that they have free range within. Something along those lines.

Right now it's hard to say how much of the aggression you are seeing is behavior or medically related (this the need for vet care). Once seizures are treated, your trainer should be able to start working on safely reintroducing the dogs. He/she should also be talking about redirected aggression and ways to manage and train for it. Redirected aggression is a common cause of aggression between 2 or more dogs living together at specific exciting locations like the door or a fence line. It also may be what's happening when your boy attacks you when trying to break up a fight. Dogs will redirect onto people as well as other dogs.

Good luck! Please keep us posted about your progress!

 

[Bigargylesock]

Actually I may scratch my previous suggestion and echo @kmes . Go to the vet first, see if meds help. The vet will most likely suggest a MRI or other tests if there aren't improvements, but at least see if medication can help first. Then, if referred for further neuro testing, see what funding is out there for those who may not be able to afford it.

There are several places where I live that specialize in all the "special" animal stuff...neurology, dermatology, arthritis, etc etc etc. They all have donation programs and funds to distribute for those who have animals who need services but also need financial help.

Good luck!

 

[amaryllis]

Seizures aren't a laughing matter, they can cause serious brain damage or even death. You simply cannot allow him to have seizures every day. If you cannot afford treatment, you need to give him to someone who can. Then you need to at the very least spay the female, because three generations of seizures is more than enough. It needs to end here.

 

[kaemaahl]

You have received good advice here. It would be most responsible to surrender at least one of your dogs. And to have at least one of the remaining dogs spayed/neutered so they don't produce more inbred puppies, that was very irresponsible of you to allow happen.
On that note, its possible your dog is having seizures and is behaving aggressively due to being inbred w/ bad genes.
I stress again, if they are fighting many times a day, you have been bitten multiple times, you cannot afford to care for them properly, it is absolutely imperative that you remove at least one if not more from your house, and have the remaining dog/s spayed/neutered.
I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but it is absolutely the truth.
Posted via Mobile Device

I wasn't asking for a lecture. I was asking for help. If this is the kind of help I can expect from you, please just stay off of my post.

 

[kaemaahl]

Seizures aren't a laughing matter, they can cause serious brain damage or even death. You simply cannot allow him to have seizures every day. If you cannot afford treatment, you need to give him to someone who can. Then you need to at the very least spay the female, because three generations of seizures is more than enough. It needs to end here.

Ok, i guess i'm just done here. I wasn't asking to be lectured or looked down on. You don't just throw away a family member. Thanks to the people who gave actual advice that wasn't "give your family member that you love away".

 

[kaemaahl]

The average family doesn't have lots of money to spend on animal care. Does that mean they shouldn't be allowed to have a pet that loves them and they love? I guess it was a mistake to ask anyone for advice, because telling me to "surrender my dog" is asinine.

 

[PoppyKenna]

The average family doesn't have lots of money to spend on animal care. Does that mean they shouldn't be allowed to have a pet that loves them and they love? I guess it was a mistake to ask anyone for advice, because telling me to "surrender my dog" is asinine.

That's fair, and I understand your viewpoint. I'm a college student working two jobs to try and provide for myself, my education, and my dog and it can be downright hard sometimes - especially as my dog is fairly high needs.

That said, I think the point others were trying to make is that somehow this dog needs care. Seizures are comparable to cancer in some ways; they don't just go away on their own and they do irreparable damage the longer they are left untreated.

BUT at this point I don't think it's unaffordable; I don't think you need to jump to MRIs or anything just yet. Just take your dog in for a checkup at your regular vet. If you can keep a detailed journal of your dog's issues, it would be very helpful - anything you may notice like a stiffening of posture, far-off look in the eyes, any sort of loss of control, or anything else that seems strange, even if it seems insignificant - it could point to a seizure. Honestly, some epilepsy medications aren't prohibitively expensive and could very well solve most of your problems, or at least give you a solid foundation to do some behavioral modification.

Obviously, the choice is up to you. If you don't want to give up a dog, you may need to crate-rotate and never let the dogs have access to each other. But (and note, I am NOT a vet) my gut says this is tied to the seizure somehow and that finding a way to take care of that would give your boy a happier, healthier, better life.

 

[kaemaahl]

That's fair, and I understand your viewpoint. I'm a college student working two jobs to try and provide for myself, my education, and my dog and it can be downright hard sometimes - especially as my dog is fairly high needs.

That said, I think the point others were trying to make is that somehow this dog needs care. Seizures are comparable to cancer in some ways; they don't just go away on their own and they do irreparable damage the longer they are left untreated.

BUT at this point I don't think it's unaffordable; I don't think you need to jump to MRIs or anything just yet. Just take your dog in for a checkup at your regular vet. If you can keep a detailed journal of your dog's issues, it would be very helpful - anything you may notice like a stiffening of posture, far-off look in the eyes, any sort of loss of control, or anything else that seems strange, even if it seems insignificant - it could point to a seizure. Honestly, some epilepsy medications aren't prohibitively expensive and could very well solve most of your problems, or at least give you a solid foundation to do some behavioral modification.

Obviously, the choice is up to you. If you don't want to give up a dog, you may need to crate-rotate and never let the dogs have access to each other. But (and note, I am NOT a vet) my gut says this is tied to the seizure somehow and that finding a way to take care of that would give your boy a happier, healthier, better life.

Its extremely feasible to carry them to a vet. Telling me my dogs need to be surrendered to a rescue is just stupid. There's noone in this world that will love these dogs like I do. I was there for each of their births. CiCi was my father's dog that I got when he had a stroke and couldn't take care of her anymore. It just amazes me that an animal lover would tell another animal lover that they need to surrender their pets. It would be different if you KNEW me, and KNEW I was a bad pet owner. I thank you guys who did help, and I'll be taking my dog to the vet on my day off. As for the rest of you, thanks for turning me away from this forum. I hope you all take this as a cautionary tale of how to treat new members.