Jindo Puppy Woes - very independent mind!

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Jindo Puppy Woes - very independent mind!

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Old 04-19-2013, 01:12 PM
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Question Jindo Puppy Woes - very independent mind!

Hi folks,

I just joined dog forum and this is my first thread about my 10 week old Jindo pup Baileymoon. (first time puppy owner here.) She has already reduced me to tears and has me seriously doubting myself and every decision i make. Yes, I know Jindos are an independent minded breed and need lots of mental stimulation and training. They can be quite aloof and almost cat like, and this describes her to a TEE.

This is where things go downhill fast: When she does things like pull at my pant legs or bite at my hands too hard I do what everyone has suggested on these forums, either yelp loudly (which works some of the time) or redirect her (only works for about 10 seconds) or ignore her. And here lies the real problem: ignoring her just doesn't work. If i ignore her she just continues to shred at my legs or pants and if i try stepping over the baby gate to ignore her she simply turns to the couch or floor or door frame or anything at all really, and lets loose with the gnawing and chewing. Its like she does not give a hoot about my ignoring her, she is just determined to chew on forbidden objects. She also tends to behave the same way when training her on recall, sometimes she just doesn't care about coming to us no matter how "fun" we make it.

Finally, my hubby and i are having an issue with how she responds to us. She does better for me, sits and lays down and accepts the rewards fine. But with my husband, its all snaps and bites and over excited treat chomping. She has already drawn blood a few times from just getting the treat while he practices 'heel' or even something as calm and easy as 'sit'! Its driving him to a point of utter frustration and dismay. So of course it makes me react negatively as well and is damaging our trust in her totally. Even though we try to keep things positive, its difficult when she viciously snaps at my husbands hand. We have tried slowing down his hand movements, calming his tone of command, holding his hand and treat further from her face-- nothing works. When it comes to him she just gets all snappish. Those little needle teeth are tearing our hearts out via his hand...

Thank you to anyone who has taken the time to read this, and I cannot express how grateful i am to anyone who chooses to reply with advice.

Thank you too dog forum, for providing this format for communication and support.

Suja and Baileymoon
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Old 04-19-2013, 01:37 PM
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The chances of your Jindo ever having a solid recall is really really small. Continue to work on it sure, but nderstand and accept that she will very likely always be an ON leash dog.

2nd thing. She's only 10 weeks old! I don't know how long you've had her but she's 10 weeks old! It takes HUGE amounts of time to teach ANY pup what you're trying to get across, never mind a true primitive like a Jindo.

When you rdirect what are you doing? Details as much as possible.

And yes I have a clue what you're going through, I have a New Guinea Singing Dog.
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Old 04-19-2013, 02:22 PM
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For the land sharking I'd get an ex-pen, or completely puppy proof room. I'd also give up the yelping, some pups seem to regard a human yelping as them turning into a giant squeeky toy. What I'd do is when she bites detach her and give her a toy (I used stuffed animals) and play with her with it, if she drops it to bite you give it to her again, and if she drops it and bites you a third time put her in the ex-pen or puppy proof room and leave her there for a couple minutes then let her out to try again. Do that EVERY time she bites. My terrier didn't care about me ignoring him to much, but he did LOVE to play so teaching him that biting the stuffed animal got me to play with him and biting me got him no playing worked.

For recall you may have to find a jackpot treat and only give it to her for reacall, but I agree with Ruthcatrin and think she may never have a truly solid recall. Some breeds are just known for being more interested in doing their own thing rather then obeying their owners. My terrier was one like that.

How is your husband giving her the treats? My boy would take treats from me just fine, but with others he's try snatching them and grab fingers when he did so. He rarely did that to me because he knew I'd quickly palm the treat rather then give it to him if I saw he was going to try and snatch it. To do that I'd have my fist closed and the treat between my thumb and index finger, if he snatched I'd turn my wrist in and drop the treat into my fist.
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Old 04-19-2013, 02:35 PM
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Yup yup on the constant redirecting. Yipping didn't work with Arty, we just said "ow!" and redirected, again.....Its going to take time though. I think Arty was 9months give or take before he finally REALLY understood that chomping on us during play was a bad thing. We did have him taking treats with a soft mouth fairly quickly though. Hold something YUMMY in your fist so the pup can just smell it, and offer your fist to the pup. She WILL chew on your hand, but as soon as she licks give her the treat. And repeat!

Ditto the xpen, or consider crate training her if you haven't already. Arty was climbing xpens and baby gates by 16 weeks.
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Last edited by ruthcatrin; 04-19-2013 at 02:40 PM.
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Old 04-19-2013, 03:25 PM
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Wow, thanks for the suggestions and kindly reminder that she is still a baby mammal and i need to go slow with expectations. When she is doing something i dont like i redirect like this: Lets say biting pants, i firmly say OFF and then I get her attention (baileymoon!), do a 'sit' or 'lay down' and upon successful response will reward her with either play, toy or treat. Thankfully that seems to work for now. But in a limited way, naturally she has a short attention span so is quick to get into trouble again.

Great idea with the fisted treat/ licking response, I will try that one as well as keeping the treat palmed and not in sight while training.

Though i listed my woes on this thread, we do have many joys and blessings too, crate training was a breeze i could barely even call it training as she loved her 'room' at first sight. I also feel super happy about the housebreaking, I've had her a month and only two pee accidents, night one and night two, never again since then.

Will consider the puppy proof room, i have a front hall that is empty at the moment, maybe i can gate that off. So i guess i would have to put her in there immediately after the undesired behavior? So that its connected with what she is doing? Seems tricky but a good idea.

THANK YOU BOTH!!
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Old 04-19-2013, 03:37 PM
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Mind, she'll likely start chewing on corners and molding.....the joys of managing a primitive pup!

Singers I know often tend to 'lock in' on whatever they're attacking (which is why its so hard to redirect). Arty's going on 1.5yrs and STILL does that. The good news of that is that at this point the only thing he really does that to any more is my other dog, who's more than capable of squashing him when need by (sometimes litterally).

You're right, SOME things she's going to learn so quickly....you'll be amazed. Others....yah, Arty still gets called the brainless wonder on occasion.....

You may want to keep her leashed in the house too. We left Arty dragging a leash in the house for several months. It requires supervision, so the leash doesn't get caught on something and choke her, but it means that you always have a handle to grab. Or put a foot on. A foot on the leash handle was a very quick and easy way to stop him from going after one of the cats, and I could have my foot OFF the leash by the time he turned around to try to figure out WHAT??

Also for recall work, and for allowing her to play in the yard, a 15ft or longer leash is a godsend IMO.
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Old 04-19-2013, 03:47 PM
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Haha, primitive pup indeed! I never thought a dog could chew on a hard wood floor but somehow she manages to get it done! I dont know if there is a place in this world that could be proofed against her. Yup, she is clever~~~~ too clever!!


I also have a question about bathing puppies for the first time. She seems to dislike water already, and if you've seen the pics i have of her on file you will she is ALL WHITE, and we live in the country. Lately she is more grayish dust color than white. I've been reading differing opinions. Some say just get into it and bathe her, others suggest starting out slow, baby steps. Ive opted for the second route. I got her into the dry tub yesterday and today and played and gave treats in there, then tomorrow i think i will do the same but turn the water on. No bath yet, just run the water so she can hear the sound and see h2o.

Is this too much, should i just go for it? Thoughts?

we thank you!!!

Suja
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Old 04-19-2013, 03:58 PM
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I went for the dump them in the tub and wash method lol, but going slowly is probly less tramatic for the pup!

If she likes peanut butter try smearing it around the inside for her to lick off.

And unscented baby wipes might help with some of the grey!
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Old 04-19-2013, 04:00 PM
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LOL, I was blessed the my terrier was not interested in chewing all that much, so I don't have to much advise on how to manage a dog snacking on the house. I've read to deny them access to whatever is inappropriate for them to chew on, and to redirect them onto appropriate chews. Some people have success with the no chew sprays, but others say that their pup seems to like the taste of it.

I redirected Shadow onto a toy when he was biting me because doing that taught him what he could bite on top of teaching him not to bite on me.

As a puppy Shadow had the attention span of a gnat and was completely hyper, he also seemed to be only interested in doing what he wanted to do and that was NOT obeying my commands unless I had convinced him that obeying me got him what he wanted. The joys of a high energy, independent, pup!

In addition to giving her a time out for undesirable behavior your going to have to also try and teach her what she is supposed to be doing. It's actually easier to teach a dog what it's supposed to do, then it is to teach it what it isn't supposed to do. It's giving them choices, and having them choose what you want them to do be terrific, and choosing what they want to do cause something not to happen. For example. When I lived in the city I insisted Shadow sit at corners before we crossed the street. To get him to do that I first made sure he knew the sit command, once he knew that I'd take him for a walk and we'd come to the corner, I'd tell him to sit and he wouldn't listen he wanted to keep walking. So I'd stand there with him, occasionally telling him to sit. When he finally sat he got what he wanted which was to continue walking. He had a choice though, he could keep standing and pulling on the leash getting no where, or he could sit like I told him to and get what he wanted which was to keep walking. Same theory with play, he could bite the toy and play with me, or he could bite me and cause me to go away. He could act a fool 4 AM in the morning and be put outside (he wanted to be inside) or he could be calm and stay inside.
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Old 04-19-2013, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ninjitsuja View Post
Haha, primitive pup indeed! I never thought a dog could chew on a hard wood floor but somehow she manages to get it done! I dont know if there is a place in this world that could be proofed against her. Yup, she is clever~~~~ too clever!!


I also have a question about bathing puppies for the first time. She seems to dislike water already, and if you've seen the pics i have of her on file you will she is ALL WHITE, and we live in the country. Lately she is more grayish dust color than white. I've been reading differing opinions. Some say just get into it and bathe her, others suggest starting out slow, baby steps. Ive opted for the second route. I got her into the dry tub yesterday and today and played and gave treats in there, then tomorrow i think i will do the same but turn the water on. No bath yet, just run the water so she can hear the sound and see h2o.

Is this too much, should i just go for it? Thoughts?

we thank you!!!

Suja

If she's filthy then you may just have to go for the get it done method. If she isn't I'd try the slowly getting her used to it method.

Shadow wasn't all that clever, but my Jersey was I always said if that dog had had thumbs there would have been no stopping her. She learned to open gates by watching me, she learned she could hop the baby gate by watching me, I could almost see the wheels turning in her head as she thought stuff out.
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