Attached to my room? - Page 2

Go Back   Dog Forum > Keeping and Caring for Dogs > Dog Training and Behavior

Attached to my room?

This is a discussion on Attached to my room? within the Dog Training and Behavior forums, part of the Keeping and Caring for Dogs category; So interesting thing happened today. Today was my first day of work so I was gone for about 7 hours. Dad was home alone with ...

User Tag List

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-23-2009, 05:33 PM
  #11
Member
 
StormyHotWolf88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Long island, New York
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
So interesting thing happened today. Today was my first day of work so I was gone for about 7 hours. Dad was home alone with him. Apparently, the entire day, even when my brother got home, Strider didn't bark or growl at them.

Now that I think about it, he has jumped up on me a couple times trying to hug my leg (not hump) so I wouldn't leave his area in which I immediately grab his paws, lift him off and drop him. He's also nipped at my heels in which I mostly ignore until annoyed, turn and shout "hey" and he backs off. One time while rubbing his tummy did I see his lipstick peak out a little but quickly went away. I thought that was odd and mentioned it to my boyfriend since the dog is neutered and I always avoid that area.

Apparently, he only barks and growls if I'm home and is worse if I'm in my room.

Today he was a bit better with everyone. He was able to be in the kitchen, sitting quietly beside me with all four of us there. He did growl and bark a bit when they re-entered the room but he wasn't as menacing around my brother considerably. I think it helped we weren't in my room. Dad also proceeded to chase him a little around the house when he growled and barked at him but he soon came back to sit with me.

Also they entered my room with him and he of course barked and growled but he calmed down with us petting, mom talking cheerfully and we were hugging and kissing on each other in front of him. Kinda like showing him the relationship between us that it was ok for us to touch each other. Kinda calmed him a little but he still watched. However when Mom left the room and my brother hugged me, Strider stood on his hind legs, with one paw on my hip as support. My first dog Sam actually did the same thing to me with a previous boyfriend.

Dad singing to him confused him a little lol...

I wonder why he's so overprotective of me and in such a short amount of time?
StormyHotWolf88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2009, 05:43 PM
  #12
Senior Member
 
fawkese1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California...in the mountains
Posts: 22,639
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
it only took clover one split second to glue himself to me like that......the same type of training still applies though....
glad things are starting to work out better....



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
fawkese1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2009, 06:06 PM
  #13
Member
 
StormyHotWolf88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Long island, New York
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Thanks, just what I wanted to know.
StormyHotWolf88 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 09-24-2009, 10:08 PM
  #14
Member
 
StormyHotWolf88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Long island, New York
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
HUZZAH! I'VE HAD A MASSIVE BREAK THROUGH!

Today, I got annoyed at him because he started barking 4 in the morning because Dad was getting ready for work. I couldn't get him to stop so I locked him in his cage. However at 7 when my brother and mother started getting ready, he barked from his cage because he could hear them. Now I'm up and cranky, I took his cage out of my room, into the living room and locked him in there then went back to sleep. I listened to him try to open it until everyone left. Found out before mom left that he took a piss in their room. So before I let him out I got the pet urine cleaner and carpet cleaner. I was hoping that only happened because I didn't walk him at 5 and he couldn't hold it since I gave him water after our nightly walk. He looked dehydrated and he did in fact drank the whole bowl which he hasn't done before.
Walked him, spent a little time with him before I left for 5 hours. I ran into my cousin accidentally who has a girlfriend that lives in my town so I thought of this as someone new to practice with Strider. So I told him to stay outside, ran in got a hand full of treats and then invited him inside. My cousin is sensitive to dogs so he knew just how to not seem threatening at all. Quickly Strider stopped barking, walked behind me, sniffed him from there and was soon eating from his hand.
Soon my brother came home, since my brother wasn't prepared with treats, I got in Strider's face on my knees and looked him in the eyes while saying in a dark tone "Stop it" Strider responded, with low woofs under his breath. When he looked at my brother and began growling I moved in his line of sight and did the dark tone again until he finally lied down. Seeing my success, I did this for the rest of the night, even stomping my foot if I'm up too high and still encouraged treats from my brother. However I did not allow my brother to mimic the same tactics. He only answers to me plus to protect him from anyone that would abuse it.
The test came for when Dad came home. He started to bark but I called his name. He flinched then sat down.
Annoyingly, Dad didn't acknowledge our quick progress until much later when Strider didn't even bother to growl or get up.
I was so happy that I put in mixables in his food for the first time and praised him.
He's still growling under his breath a little towards my brother, but he's more accepting of his presence now. Just glad I was finally able to make it clear that I didn't like the behavior.
StormyHotWolf88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 10:52 AM
  #15
Senior Member
 
Mikey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Edmonton, AB
Posts: 7,579
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
That's wonderful!!! I'm so happy for you and Strider
Mikey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 01:35 PM
  #16
Senior Member
 
fawkese1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California...in the mountains
Posts: 22,639
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by StormyHotWolf88 View Post
HUZZAH! I'VE HAD A MASSIVE BREAK THROUGH!

Today, I got annoyed at him because he started barking 4 in the morning because Dad was getting ready for work. I couldn't get him to stop so I locked him in his cage. However at 7 when my brother and mother started getting ready, he barked from his cage because he could hear them. Now I'm up and cranky, I took his cage out of my room, into the living room and locked him in there then went back to sleep. I listened to him try to open it until everyone left. Found out before mom left that he took a piss in their room. So before I let him out I got the pet urine cleaner and carpet cleaner. I was hoping that only happened because I didn't walk him at 5 and he couldn't hold it since I gave him water after our nightly walk. He looked dehydrated and he did in fact drank the whole bowl which he hasn't done before.
Walked him, spent a little time with him before I left for 5 hours. I ran into my cousin accidentally who has a girlfriend that lives in my town so I thought of this as someone new to practice with Strider. So I told him to stay outside, ran in got a hand full of treats and then invited him inside. My cousin is sensitive to dogs so he knew just how to not seem threatening at all. Quickly Strider stopped barking, walked behind me, sniffed him from there and was soon eating from his hand.
Soon my brother came home, since my brother wasn't prepared with treats, I got in Strider's face on my knees and looked him in the eyes while saying in a dark tone "Stop it" Strider responded, with low woofs under his breath. When he looked at my brother and began growling I moved in his line of sight and did the dark tone again until he finally lied down. Seeing my success, I did this for the rest of the night, even stomping my foot if I'm up too high and still encouraged treats from my brother. However I did not allow my brother to mimic the same tactics. He only answers to me plus to protect him from anyone that would abuse it.
The test came for when Dad came home. He started to bark but I called his name. He flinched then sat down.
Annoyingly, Dad didn't acknowledge our quick progress until much later when Strider didn't even bother to growl or get up.
I was so happy that I put in mixables in his food for the first time and praised him.
He's still growling under his breath a little towards my brother, but he's more accepting of his presence now. Just glad I was finally able to make it clear that I didn't like the behavior.
i don't want to sound negative about this, but i would like to caution you against continuing in this way with your dog. my impression of what you are describing is that you are correcting your dog for this behavior. when you correct a dog for this, you teach him that it is not okay to growl at someone. this seems like the right thing to do, right? but look at it this way...your dog can't look at someone and say "please don't do that, you are scaring me!" your dog's ability to communicate is limited (from a human perspective) he can only use a few vocalizations and his body language...which humans, as primates often fail to read....by teaching your dog that it is not okay to growl, you are taking away a very valuable means of communication that your dog is giving. i hear people describe situations where a dog growls/snaps at them as "that dog just tried to bite me!" i promise you...dogs don't try to bite. if a dog wants to bite you, for whatever reason, he does. a dog that is growling/snapping/barking/crouching/flinching etc is a dog that doesn't want to bite you and is trying to tell you something, usually it's "hey man, i am really freaked out right now!!!"
by using such intimidating body language as a correction, you also run a risk of damaging your relationship with strider....his perspective (i know he is a dog and it is very hard to interperet this...but just to get you thinking about it) could easily be...."uh oh, whenever i'm scared, mom gets mad at me...better not go to her when something scary is happening" what you described as strider's reaction to this is not a dog that learned to trust anyone, but a dog that just learned to suppress a valuable warning communication. if you hear someone describe a dog bit like this "it came out of no where, the dog didn't even growl or anything!" that is because the dog was punished for growling, so he learned not to, but he never learned to trust people he doesn't know or big guys with deep voices wearing hats or little kids that have fast, jerky (ie scary) movement, or delivery men who show up in big loud scary trucks and don't give any of the appropriate canine greetings.....whatever it was that he was afraid of
i personally want my dog to tell people to back off rather than get freaked out and feel like he doesn't have any choice but to bite them.
believe me, i know that it is a very frustrating behavior to deal with (for me, i would actually describe it as heartbreaking). and the counter conditioning process is painfully long. i have to go through all sorts of hoops to do just about anything without clover...make sure no one goes in the back yard when he is there, make sure my roommate can function in the house without risk of serious injury from my dog. right now, i feel really tied down to him bc i only have my sister or one other friend that he can be left with so i don't get to do any fun stuff unless it is something i can take him along for....that is just how it is right now. everyday clover improves and the counter conditioning games get better. he'll now take treats from my roommate when she is the only person home with him, yesterday, she was able to ask him into the house give him a treat, then ask him out again to go potty. she was so excited (we've been working on it daily!) she kept taking him out again that evening just because....
i am not trying to negate your experience or anything like that, and i hope i haven't made you feel bad or anything, that was definitely not my intention. i believe it is human nature to react to your dog's behavior the way that you have and many many people have done so for a long time. someone else may read this thread and have a completely different perception of the situation than i do...but i am speaking from personal experience...all that i have learned in the last few months....again, please read the books that i suggested, or atleast just google "counter conditioning".
i still think that you are doing well with strider....and that you will eventually develop a great relationship with him.....



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
fawkese1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 02:07 PM
  #17
Senior Member
 
Criosphynx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Som'where between Utopia and Insomnia.
Posts: 11,482
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Dr Ian dunbar says that correcting growling is like "removing the ticker from the time bomb. ..."

Growling is the dog saying I will bite you if you touch me...unfortunately correcting the growling doesn't correct the dogs desire to be left alone...all it does is teach the dog to not growl...just bite...

ever hear people say the dog "bit me without warning"? Thats because (likely) growling was corrected so the dog quit offering it.

I know right now it seems like a good solution and it seems like its working...but its only a bandaid and the dog is still scared...growling or not... also...like Fawkese mentioned...it does nothing for the relationship between you two, hes learning when scary things appear, you become scary too.

What I would do is make a pact with my dog...if hes growling I either remove him or remove the trigger...I do this to my own dogs, it fosters trust, they know I will always make the scary thing go away (if I can)


if the dog is growling that means the dog is over his threshold for tolerance...

If a dog is over threshold it cannot learn anything new. Basically the dogs common sence turns off since its in fight or flight (survival) mode.


If the dog stops growling on its own, you can treat treat treat...but don't force him to stop and then treat...its pointless.

also, you are going to want to hide the treats better...its sounding to me like the dog is cueing off the sight of treats meaning the person is ok...this wont work long term as the dog will simply still react to anyone who doesn't have food....try to make it so the treats are out of sight...in a pocket...on a table etc. This way it becomes a reward (oh wow you did good heres a surprise!) not a bribe (If you ignore this scary guy I'll give you this treat) this is very important for the long term.

anyway..Iam glad you are making progress and we are here to help you.

ETA: this may help you... This is the look at that game...the dog is click/treated for looking at the trigger BEFORE he can react. You have to be fast, but its worth it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLdsi9b-U5s



Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!

Last edited by Criosphynx; 09-25-2009 at 02:15 PM.
Criosphynx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 05:41 PM
  #18
Member
 
StormyHotWolf88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Long island, New York
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I'm still a little confused by the "look at that" game since with Sam, I said "Look, Sam Look!" and he learned to look in the direction I was pointing because it was usually something interesting that made him happy. Is the dog simply just looking at something and then treat? I don't hear or see a command from the owner take the video.

Right now, I'm not entirely sure it's only scared he's feeling. I say this only because of the positions he takes and how he acts in other parts of the house. Where he is on a forward slope: Nose high, back legs out but holding him so his butt is close to the ground. Princess made the same position sometimes but it was so quick and her tail was wagging, I couldn't really tell the emotion behind it. It was like she was happy to see me but then she was... submitting? Anywhere else around the house, he's fine. He's quiet, he's by my side, he comes to my mother. Dad hasn't really interacted with him much at all... He tolerates my brother petting him, very few grumbles. My room it's like "back off"

Alright. Just now my dad got home... Upon hearing the door and him barking, I got up and we went to the door together. Strider's barks became more alarmed upon seeing him. I let Strider run to my room. Dad proceeded with, " I don't know Carly, I think this isn't a good match" I'm like, "What are you talking about? It's been only a week! He's doing very well! You're just not helping with him!" He was like "I don't know, I think he's a dumb dog" I got angry "He's a VERY smart dog, YOU'RE being very mean to him and not giving him a chance!" So he was like, "Oh? so what am I doing wrong?! I'm not doing anything!" I told him, "Your clapping your hands in his face, you advance upon him, You chase him around the house YOU'RE SCARING HIM!" So he said, "Well I think he's a dominating dog" "I said he wasn't so he said, why do you say that? I told him "Because he listens to me to the T. He proved this to me when I accidentally dropped the leash When I wrapped it around my arm but forgot the loop since I was doing something with my other hand and he started going forward. I called to him for attention, turned my back to him, did the hand signal and step for come... he came and sat next to me... Also, I just brought a small stray (with collar but no tags) in the house a couple hours ago before Animal Police could take her and they got a long just fine, playing in the living room.(initially I had locked her in the crate and Strider came from a two dog home) He then looked at Strider who sat nicely a foot from me then said, "Fine, then tell me what to do..." I went into my room, took The other end of the leash off my bed and said, "At least read the introduction, it's only 6 pages long..."

By this time Strider had retreated to my room. I stroked his sides before climbing on the bed. He started barking again at my dad, but with my foot, I stroked his back and made a "Shhhhhhh" sound and his bark got softer until he lied back down.

I seriously need to take him to a dog park soon. I think the rough play was what he needed, since I can't provide it because of my allergy (can't be scratched, bitten or put hands in eyes after petting) So wrestling is completely out of the question.

I think Strider isn't the problem really. I think it might really be my brother and my Dad's fault for not knowing/watching their body movements. Strider went ABSOLUTELY INSANE when I tried the walking with brother again with him in front. Strider was peeing and he doesn't lift his leg. My brother was like, "Oh he doesn't do the-" He lifts his leg slightly and Strider went crazy, I had to hold on to him for dear life until I could get him to calm down. I looked at my brother while strider thrashed about and told him to walk away. He stopped after a few feet and I said further til he was at the end of the block. Strider then calmed enough to be able to make the rest of the trip.

So yeah, I won't do the intimidating thing again probably.
StormyHotWolf88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 06:57 PM
  #19
Senior Member
 
fawkese1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California...in the mountains
Posts: 22,639
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
i'm sure that strider is going through all sorts of things that we cannot even imagine.... i'm glad that you got that book, it is such good info....i hope that your dad gets something from it too....a lot of people call almost all dog behavior "dominating" i used to think of it like this too. clover is my first rescue dog and the first dog i've had in a while. i've spent tons of time reading dog stuff, and training stuff. despite what some folks will say, it isn't really intuitive, and you aren't a bad person if you don't "get it" i'm really glad that i took the time to read up on stuff, all the dogs we had when i was growing up were trained with very strict correction methods which all really "seemed" to work. however, if i had done any of those things with clover, i'm not sure he would have lasted in my house...i even think it would have resulted in a serious bite (he's getting pretty big!)
exercise and routine also help, anyone with a dog of similar size could be a good candidate for playmate with strider. if your yard is fenced, you could get a chuck-it for playing ball (that way you won't have to touch the ball) if you run/jog, strider would be a great companion.
just remember:
1 go slowly, don't push anyone (even if it's your dad and he really needs it)
2 relationships take time to build, you'll be thankful tomorrow for the patience you had today and so will strider...he is counting on you to help him with this
3 never correct a dog unless you know beyond a shadow of a doubt exactly what the right correction for the behavior is. if you have to use a correction more than 2 times, it isn't working. to continue to use a correction after this point is considered abusive by some.
4 neither fear nor aggression can be corrected, these behaviors need to be counter conditioned.
5 if you are frustrated, don't bother. its as simple as that, remove yourself and/or your dog from the situation.

you'll get tons of support here, so please keep us posted



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
fawkese1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2009, 07:04 PM
  #20
Senior Member
 
fawkese1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California...in the mountains
Posts: 22,639
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
oh "look at that" start out at a distance that the dog is not reacting to a trigger, but is aware of its presence. every time the dog looks in the direction of the trigger and doesn't react, "mark" the behavior...use your marker word/clicker, and reward. once the dog gets this you can add in your cue "look at that" then same thing mark and reward. you can move closer to the trigger in very small increments, and continue. if the dog startst to react, move back to whichever level you were at before the dog started to react, and continue.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
fawkese1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Tags
introduction, nervous, possesive

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Room for just ONE more.... Ladipyg New Additions 7 02-04-2010 05:28 PM


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.