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Gentle Lead vs Harness?

9K views 34 replies 16 participants last post by  adamsNancy 
#1 ·
We are leash training our puppy, and I'm wondering if the Gentle Lead is better than the harness we have been using. He pulls on us a lot and is pretty strong, especially for me.

Does anyone have any opinions on these?
 
#2 ·
I have both
the front clip harness helps with pulling a little but when my pit wants to get to a cat he still pulls way too much he doesn't pull on a walk 90% of the time but when he does he's really strong lol
The gentle leader stops the pulling completely but my pit spends the entire time trying to get it off (he has been able to remove it so they def need to be worked with to like it) he hates it I did try to condition him to like it but he just hates it no mater what I do I have a Great Dane I use the gentle leader on and it works fantastic for her she leaves it on after I worked with her she is reactive to other dogs on leash so the gentle leader has been extremely helpful with that


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#3 ·
Please don't use a gentle leader on a puppy, it is not a suitable tool for a very young dog. Actually, I would never use one, I would use a prong collar before I would ever use a head halter.

What kind of harness are you using? If it's a back connecting one, then it is going to encourage pulling. If you are wanting a no-pull one, I would recommend against the EZ walk or Sensation front attachment harnesses and go with a harness that has two connection points - front and back and use it with a double ended leash, the best harnesses are, IMO, the Balance Harness (top choice) or the Freedom No-pull harness.
 
#4 ·
He's 11 months old, so almost full grown. He's the same size of the beagle mix that I babysit sometimes that has one, and he seems to like it, so that's why I was considering it.

We've been having issues with him when he sees other animals outside, like squirrels or this morning he thought he could take on the deer, and he pulls a lot. My husband can get him under control, but I'm tiny and I'm afraid he'll pull away from me. We have a front clasp harness that can also be used in the car for restraint. We have a regular leash with a martingale collar but he pulls so much that he will choke himself and gag.
 
#5 ·
Obviously training is the best way to go the gentle leader doesn't fix the problem it just makes it easier to manage but I def would condition your dog to it slowly not just throw it on and go
I would never use a prong collar on my dog for any reason
Currently I am working with my girl on "touch " practice which has been the most helpful for her reactivity so far so def recommend that
I started working in the living room then worked up to the yard now she does well with dogs across the street it really does work amazingly just takes time
https://youtu.be/RWSJVwZybwo
Great distraction tool


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#6 ·
We've been working on distraction tools and getting him to make eye contact with us when we call his name. He doesn't care about the other dogs much, but the wildlife in the backyard makes him go nuts. We have deer, foxes, coyotes, and there has been a black bear sighting up the road. I really worry that he's going to pull away from me and chase after them.

Oddly though, when I take him jogging with me on the trails, he doesn't pull on me and will run by my side.
 
#7 ·
I've used both gentle leaders and front clipping harnesses on my dogs. My lab was trained in a Gentle Leader and I honestly love it. I would recommend speaking with a trainer as there are a few things that you will have to work through. First you have to condition the dog to take the gentle leader using treats and getting the dog comfortable with it on their nose. Then you will have to learn to walk on a looser lead. I usually walk with a completely slack leash with her only feeling pressure on the lead when she has gone too far. Also you would want to teach the dog that when they feel pressure they should look to you for direction.

Front clipping harnesses work in a similar way. It puts their own body weight against them. When they go to pull it is going to turn heir shoulders back towards you. Depending on the dog it can alleviate the fulling, or some dogs learn to pull through them. I use the front clip on the Ruffwear Front Range for my aussie.

Have you spoken with a trainer? I highly recommend speaking with a trainer.
 
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#8 ·
Yep, we go to a class on Saturdays. A few of the dogs there have gentle leads too. I don't know if I'm noticing them more because I was thinking of getting one, or if a lot of people are actually using them.
 
#9 ·
I always noticed a lot of people use them. I do get comments a lot when Roxie has her's on (although it's black and she is black). I've been asked many times why she has a muzzle on. I really like it, especially for her. She's pretty much trained now, but when I'm going to a place that may have a lot going on or that she's never been I will put it on her to have the utmost control.
 
#10 ·
Just so you know, the gentle leader was based on pack leader theory, but I doubt many +R trainers know this.

Ms. Foster [co-creator of the gentle leader] said the halter succeeds because of a dog's instincts. ''You will see the pack leader putting his mouth around the mouth of the other dog, applying pressure to the top of the nose to show dominance,'' she said.

Connie C. Ellis, an instructor in dog obedience in Vero Beach, Fla., said, ''The dog knows right away that you're going to have control.''
''People do want something humane that will not choke their dog,'' Dr. Anderson said. ''They want something that will give them power steering and fingertip control.''
In all honesty, it is a management tool, and the best thing is to teach loose leash walking!

A Leash That May Be More Humane - NYTimes.com
 
#11 ·
I'd only use a gentle leader or halti as an absolutely last resort. It renders a dog completely helpless and they know it.
It is incredibly effective (from the human's standpoint) for that very reason, and because it appears not to cause pain, it is considered an acceptable level of restraint, but often produces a significant change in behaviour, one I characterize as 'humbling'.
If you chose to use one, 1st you need to condition your dog to accept wearing it. Dog learns to associate wearing it with getting treats.
2nd. I highly recommend also teaching the dog to associate light directional pressure on the leash with getting a treat from the rear flank (so he doesn't freak out when he wants to go one way and feels leash pressure from the opposite direction.
3rd. Go out with a light line or tab on the halti and regular leash on collar, continue the conditioning (treats for gentle leash pressure), and work your way very slowly (over several days) to controlling your dog with a halti.
4th. Bear in mind that if your puppy or dog is given to flinging itself to the end of the leash to chase a squirrel or car, whiplash can result.
There is no collar I've ever used that is so difficult for a dog to accept, but if you absolutely have no other options, then the above steps will help your dog.

If choosing between halti or harness, then yes, harness, harness, harness, harness, please.

If you're own safety becomes a factor (sore muscles, tripping hazards, getting pulled around, sprains, shoulder/back injuries) and a harness doesn't work, there are other options that are less upsetting to a big boisterous puppy.
 
#12 ·
We mostly use the harness. It's just been easier. He's only 42 lbs, but it's muscle and he's a strong little puppy, plus I have arthritis in my hands. Our other dog was trained off leash, and she stays by our side leash or not, but this little puppy is just eager to see and do everything. He doesn't flip out and flail around, just pulls and digs in his heels if I try to pull him back towards me. Maybe the gentle lead isn't a good fit.
 
#13 ·
My guy is 40 lbs, I have torn tendons in my left hand due to a leash accident, dog on harness, so you have my sympathy.
Have you tried the front-hook harness?
 
#14 ·
Yes, that's what we are using now. We have one of those Ruffwear harnesses that has a loop in the front and back and can be used for restraint in the car. It's great when I take him jogging with me, but he still pulls on just regular walks to potty in the backyard.

I think it's all about the distractions. I don't worry about myself as much as I worry about him running off into the woods after animals (we do have him chipped). We are working on recall, but he only listens half the time, and barely ever outside.

The other night, 3 deer were using our yard to cross over to the stream about a mile back, and he was going nuts while our other dog just sat on the deck by the gazebo. I had to drag him inside because our neighbors up the road said the deer were chasing their dogs trying to stomp on them, so not taking chances.

I realize training will help situations like these, but in the meantime while we are training him, I want to keep him safe. We are building a fence around the property, but it's 2 acres and is taking a little time.
 
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#16 ·
I use the head collar connected by a double ended leash to a harness on my reactive girl. I personally am not a huge fan of it because I terrified of neck injuries, but for her it's the only thing that works. She has absolutely no issues pulling through the no pull harnesses... At anyrate I really hate putting that sort of pressure on her neck, but with the harness if she were to decided to lunge or pull pressure would be on her chest/body instead of her neck. On another note like all other tools the end goal is to eventually be able to walk without them which for the most part I can with her. We only use the head collar now if I know were going to be around a ton of other dogs or where we might run into potential triggers.

 
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#18 · (Edited by Moderator)
Neither, gentle leads can be pretty painful and risk spinal and neck damage from the unnatural movement it forces

Reference

Harnesses encourage pulling, no matter the type. Front clipping harnesses might turn a dog around, but after awhile dogs learn how to avoid this and will apply pressure on the opposite side of the leash.

A nylon martingale collar would be the most appropriate for his age, find a reputable trainer that uses training tools like the martingale and prong because you'll need to learn how to implement proper corrections with these tools.



Martingale collars distribute pressure evenly, they are much more safe than regular flat collars, halters or harnesses.
 
#19 ·
The gentle leader has been a lifesaver for me. My stubborn piper is very reactive to other dogs, especially a little chihuahua that we have to walk by on our walks. The gentle leader dramatically helped to reduce her pulling in these situations. I have linked my write up that I posted on my blog. My biggest tip is to make sure you do have it properly adjusted. My owners that say that their dog does not like the gentle leader, real just have it adjusted improperly!

Click here to read my blog post on the Gentle Leader!
 
#20 ·
We have Martingale collars on both our dogs. Our puppy will pull so much that he coughs when we just attach a leash to his collar. I will not use a prong collar.

We've just nixed the entire Gentle Lead idea, instead, I've been taking him for jogs in the morning and slower walks in the afternoon around the neighborhood with the harness on. It has a handle on the back of it, so if he starts to pull, I grab the handle and make him sit for a minute, then we try again. I'm trying to desensitize him to all the wildlife. Squirrels have been a challenge though!

He's a border collie/lab mix, and surprisingly strong for his size/age. We just had a vet visit this morning for his last booster shot, and he gained 4 lbs in 2 weeks!
 
#21 ·
Reminder that this is a force free forum, and suggestions of aversives in training, either now or in the future are not permitted. Please see the rules for any clarification.
 
#23 ·
Personally I feel none of the "tools" used for leash training actually address the issue or teach your dog how to walk at your pace. IME as soon as they come off, the dog begins pulling again because no one ever trained the dog how to walk at a human pace, they just were restricted with either pain/agitation of a prong or physical force of a head halter. Id prefer to spend the time and train the dog than restrict the dog forcefully.
 
#25 ·
While I agree with Cos that it is better to train the dog to walk at human pace, it can be a long and difficult process for a young and lively dog that just wants to run, jump, chase and lunge. Leash walking is a difficult task for dogs and yet it may the only possible outlet for exercise for some dogs, or at some times.

During the training phase (ie, before perfection is achieved) I prefer to use the least aversive tool to get the task done, and take into account both the human and dogs comfort, mental and physical. Human limbs, muscles joints and sockets are important too. Other animals deserve our protection from our rambunctious dogs behaviours (cats, other dogs, etc), so if you need a halti or gentle leader, and it's the best option you can come up with in order to give your dog the exercise he needs, go ahead and use it. Using a double leash would be the safest, as they can indeed do damage to themselves on these devices.

Slightly off-topic, but in keeping with the question. Do you play with your dog on walks? Is it possible (tugging games can be accomplished on leash, fetch not so much)? Can he catch treats tossed in the air? Can you roll treats across the ground, will he chase you & treat in hand, (lured chase games), is he interested in treats or toys when you are out on walks?
If yes, you can try to add in some 'fun' time where you teach your dog that paying attention to you is the best thing ever. This is easier said than done in a world of squirrels, geese, etc etc but taken in baby steps can lead to mutual fun.
Hope that helps out. If you need some tips on engagement (which is what the last paragraph is about), it would make an awesome fresh topic.
 
#26 ·
We nipped the tug of war game with the leash in the bud from the beginning. Never thought to bring treats with me, but I will try that. He gets most of his exercise in our backyard, but I am taking him on twice daily walks/runs to try and get him to be more leash polite. He is so easily distracted.

So far, I've been keeping to the same route and if he starts to pull on me, I stop and have him sit for a minute. He's honestly better when I run with him in the mornings, it's when I walk at a slow pace is when he wants to go chase everything. Currently, we can't have my teenage daughter walk him at all because he practically pulls and drags her.

I'm sticking with the harness though, because it has the handle on it I can hang onto if he's pulling, and he's not going to hurt himself by pulling on the leash attached to his collar.

I didn't realize the gentle lead was an aversive because everyone seems to have them at the puppy classes.
 
#27 ·
I define "aversive" by the dog; if the dog objects, and it sounds like yours did, then yes. If the dogs in class are okay with them, happy, not rolling, rubbing or dejected, then they are not aversive for those dogs.
Sounds like you have options, ie. a big backyard or jogging and the harness if you need it. My guy would so Love having a jogger in his life, your guy is a lucky dog.
ps. by tug, I meant bring along a tug toy, not biting the leash.
 
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#28 ·
We've never tried the gentle lead, so I'm not sure if he would use it. It seems like general consensus here is that they are not good.
 
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