Need advice on anti-bark collars

Go Back   Dog Forum > DogForum Community Welcome > Introductions

Need advice on anti-bark collars

This is a discussion on Need advice on anti-bark collars within the Introductions forums, part of the DogForum Community Welcome category; My wife and I have two rescue dogs, a Miniature Schnauzer, about 12-15 lbs, male, and a Bichon Frise male, 10-12 lbs. We recently moved ...

User Tag List

Like Tree21Likes
  • 5 Post By cos
  • 4 Post By Chas
  • 3 Post By Chas
  • 3 Post By Aspen726
  • 1 Post By DracoGSD
  • 1 Post By ralph124c41
  • 4 Post By ralph124c41

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-22-2017, 09:54 PM
  #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Need advice on anti-bark collars

My wife and I have two rescue dogs, a Miniature Schnauzer, about 12-15 lbs, male, and a Bichon Frise male, 10-12 lbs.
We recently moved to an apartment from a three bedroom house with a fenced back yard.
Both dogs are VERY protective and bark at everything moving they see, and at virtually every noise they hear. When they see other dogs while being walked, ALWAYS on a leash, they go nuts, bark, lunging, snarling.
They have never bitten anyone, but we can't let them get close to another dog.

Our Schnauzer has apparently, simple ideas: If it's smaller then me, it's prey, If it's larger then me, it's a threat.
I'm sorry for the long post, but we need to find a solution to their incessant barking while in the apartment, and outside.
We tried a hand held ultrasonic bark deterrent, and it worked for about two weeks for the schnauzer, until he realized it was just a noise, and wouldn't hurt him, It did not work at all on the Bichon.
Would an anti bark collar work? Can anyone recommend one?

Thank you all for ideas.
ralph124c41 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 01:57 AM
  #2
cos
Senior Member
 
cos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: The beautiful Pacific Northwest!
Posts: 825
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Do not use one. Absolutely not. Under any circumstance.

Please buy a shock collar for yourself and put it on your neck. Set it to level ONE and see if you would still place it on your dog. What will happen is it doesn't tell your dog what to do instead of barking, it tells your dog what not to do and what to fear while the reason they may be barking is fear itself. Your dog will shut down.

Try a shock collar on yourself. Humans have 13-15 epidermis layers separating the skin from our nerves that feel pain. Dogs have about 5. Im not saying this just because I don't like the idea - I used to think it was the best thing to do and it would help. I was lied to and told that dogs aren't as bothered by it. That is simply not true. I ended up with a dog that was shut down, traumatized, scared of random things he perceived and decided the shock was coming from (the couch, the living room table, the living room in general, the flower pot on the porch, all things I spent months getting him to trust again and having to RE TRAIN him to not be scared of these things). He was scared of walks and he was scared of me. This was a HUGE MISTAKE and I regret it more than any of the training decisions I've made so far. one of the times he yelped when I used it (mine was remote controlled). I will never forget how terrible I felt for causing him that pain and I still feel guilty about it to this day. After that I tried it on myself but I was too cowardly to put it to my neck after touching it with my thumb. It's awful and I forced my dog to go through that for days while a trainer advised me to set it to level 3. I tried it on myself on one.

Hire a POSITIVE REINFORCEMENT trainer that handles aggression and does NOT use aversive tools like shock prong or choke. Be aware of those that call themselves "balanced" trainers. Please don't put your dog through that and please don't make the mistake I did. Be an advocate for your dog!
Aspen726, Laco, yoshiposhi and 2 others like this.

Last edited by cos; 02-23-2017 at 02:00 AM.
cos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 07:18 AM
  #3
Senior Member
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 894
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Hi, welcome to the forum.

A bark collar may or may not work, dogs aren't good with cause and effect. For instance if they get punished every time they see a dog and bark they could just as easily think the dog is to blame as the barking. Here is a good list of things that can happen with the use of something like a bark collar Fallout from Use of Aversiveseileenanddogs .

From what you've written there are several layers to your problem:

- dog is territorial.
- dog is threatened by large dogs.
- dog hunts small dogs.
- dog barks when overstimulated.
- barking is a positive feedback loop that has been strengthened over years.

Given that list I second the need to bring in a positive trainer. There's a lot to cover and I doubt you'll find an immediate fix.

Some management ideas:
- Crates in a quiet place so they can't practice the behavior while you are away.
- Remove access to windows if possible.
- Increase training and exercise. Hard to bark if they are asleep.
- Set up tasty food mazes or kong like toys during heavy traffic times. People outside + awesome treats.
Aspen726, cos, DracoGSD and 1 others like this.
Chas is online now   Reply With Quote
 
Old 02-23-2017, 07:20 AM
  #4
Senior Member
 
Chas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 894
Mentioned: 84 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Here's a good start when looking for a trainer Certified Dog Trainer Directory - CCPDT
Aspen726, cos and ralph124c41 like this.
Chas is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 07:39 AM
  #5
Dog Forum ModeraTHOR
 
Aspen726's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: New England
Posts: 5,057
Mentioned: 1168 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
This is a force free forum and the suggestion of any aversive tools (including bark collars) is not allowed. Collars that emit a shock, vibration, sound or spray are all considered aversive. Pennies in a can as well. These tactics can cause more harm than good.

I agree with @cos and @Chaz that you should be seeking the help of a force free trainer.

If you don't have access to a trainer, check out YouTube: Kikopup and Zak George are Positive Reinforcement trainers who post FREE training videos. I don't have the links handy but I'm sure they both have "How to Train Your Dog Not to Bark" videos.

Like all training, it won't happen overnight. It will take time and patience.
cos, Laco and ralph124c41 like this.

Last edited by Aspen726; 02-23-2017 at 07:41 AM.
Aspen726 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 10:28 AM
  #6
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Oregon
Posts: 75
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I'm not opposed to training collars, first off, but a training tool that works without human interaction is very risky. Electric collars can create a lot of illogical fears, and one that goes off on its own could trigger a fear of anything. The trash can they were standing next to, that spot in the yard, the thing they are barking at, whatever it may be.

It sounds like more of a socialization problem than a barking problem. Addressing the cause of the bark rather than the bark itself would be more appropriate. Even if they learn not to bark there will still be that anxiety and 'aggression' that makes them want to.

I use a vibe collar for long distance, because when you're in the woods drawing attention to yourself by calling can be a bad idea. Had a deaf dog too that would lose track of me so I used the vibration whenever she was about to get out of sight so she could turn around and find me again.
ralph124c41 likes this.
DracoGSD is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 03:23 PM
  #7
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DracoGSD View Post
I'm not opposed to training collars, first off, but a training tool that works without human interaction is very risky. Electric collars can create a lot of illogical fears, and one that goes off on its own could trigger a fear of anything. The trash can they were standing next to, that spot in the yard, the thing they are barking at, whatever it may be.

It sounds like more of a socialization problem than a barking problem. Addressing the cause of the bark rather than the bark itself would be more appropriate. Even if they learn not to bark there will still be that anxiety and 'aggression' that makes them want to.

I use a vibe collar for long distance, because when you're in the woods drawing attention to yourself by calling can be a bad idea. Had a deaf dog too that would lose track of me so I used the vibration whenever she was about to get out of sight so she could turn around and find me again.
Draco, Many thanks! I'll look for a trainer.
DracoGSD likes this.
ralph124c41 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2017, 03:24 PM
  #8
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cos View Post
Do not use one. Absolutely not. Under any circumstance.

Please buy a shock collar for yourself and put it on your neck. Set it to level ONE and see if you would still place it on your dog. What will happen is it doesn't tell your dog what to do instead of barking, it tells your dog what not to do and what to fear while the reason they may be barking is fear itself. Your dog will shut down.

Try a shock collar on yourself. Humans have 13-15 epidermis layers separating the skin from our nerves that feel pain. Dogs have about 5. Im not saying this just because I don't like the idea - I used to think it was the best thing to do and it would help. I was lied to and told that dogs aren't as bothered by it. That is simply not true. I ended up with a dog that was shut down, traumatized, scared of random things he perceived and decided the shock was coming from (the couch, the living room table, the living room in general, the flower pot on the porch, all things I spent months getting him to trust again and having to RE TRAIN him to not be scared of these things). He was scared of walks and he was scared of me. This was a HUGE MISTAKE and I regret it more than any of the training decisions I've made so far. one of the times he yelped when I used it (mine was remote controlled). I will never forget how terrible I felt for causing him that pain and I still feel guilty about it to this day. After that I tried it on myself but I was too cowardly to put it to my neck after touching it with my thumb. It's awful and I forced my dog to go through that for days while a trainer advised me to set it to level 3. I tried it on myself on one.

Hire a POSITIVE REINFORCEMENT trainer that handles aggression and does NOT use aversive tools like shock prong or choke. Be aware of those that call themselves "balanced" trainers. Please don't put your dog through that and please don't make the mistake I did. Be an advocate for your dog!
Cos,
Many thanks for the information! I'll look for a trainer in my area.
Aspen726, cos, Laco and 1 others like this.
ralph124c41 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Tags
barking, collar, shock collar

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My puppy is starting to growl and bark at noises & people yoshiposhi Dog Training and Behavior 8 06-27-2016 12:11 PM
Advice for reactive barker? Tried quite a few methods Bubblebror12003 Dog Training and Behavior 1 03-20-2016 12:38 AM
Ignore or "no" for barking tange Dog Training and Behavior 4 11-15-2015 01:56 PM
Husky Training Advice needed!! freespiritwonder Dog Training and Behavior 3 11-14-2015 07:43 PM
Rhett and Link wear bark collars. KodaKeet Dog Pictures and Videos 0 10-30-2015 04:17 PM


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:11 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.