pit bulls...?

fawkese1

okay...so everyone has heard the term used...and everyone has heard a horror story...

i've always liked pits...even when i was a kid and my mom would freak out about me petting one or hanging out with a friend if they had one...

i've never had any fear of a pit hurting me...(i don't fear many dogs tho...i have a healthy respect for all, but not really fear) but ever since i adopted my dog, i've noticed myself having some prejudices about them... and i have some questions...

first the whole bite thing...i've read enought to know that pits actually don't have really strong bite force, rotts and GSDs have a higher bite force i believe...but even some of the pit sites i've browsed through talk about the lock jaw...again i don't believe that pits really have a locking jaw...but what started this myth...explain, and break sticks...fit into this catagory too...are they really necessary?

next the dog aggression thing...i've met all sorts of dogs of different breeds that are dog aggressive...yet pits always get such a bad rap for this (this is one of my prejudices/fears) are pits really more dog aggressive? clover has some really great friend dogs that are pits...and i have little fear with them, but when i see any dog that i don't know let's say at the dog park, i'm very careful to watch for signs of trouble, but with a pit...i've noticed that i'm slightly more anxious...should i be? do pits tend to be more dog aggressive or is it that they just aren't usually as well socialized with other dogs?

finally...now that this has come up...what is a pit? i mean...aren't all the bully breeds originally from some sort of fighting dog? even frenchies and bostons were used for fighting from what i've read...why are they accepted and not pit bulls...

so that's it for now...sure i'll have more questions as you answer these...

Alba

Well the "pitbull" got its name because they would put them in pits to fight, and Im pretty sure they originated from bulldogs. And no, pitbulls do not have locking jaws, just a myth.
Pitbulls are not more dog aggressive than any other breed, its just a part of their rep..
They were used to fight other dogs, so those fighting dogs would attack other dogs. Thats how they got it. If a pitbull was raised and socialized correctly it wont have any problems. And since I've seen it before, I believe a young fighting dog can be changed. Some people dont believe so but hey, its just my opinion.
IMO, pitbulls are just like any other dog breed (:
My mom fears them, my dad fears them, but I dont. They always got mad when I brought one home or something, so I know what you mean.

Criosphynx

well...as far as break sticks go...terriers tend to "hold on" and not snapsnapsnap...so its hard to separate fighting dogs at times.... I had a pit puppy grab Emma and do this...Honestly never observed it before (or after) that moment in person...she just held on, all emotionless...it was eerie

i find my personal rep for the breed has the LONGEST fuse I have EVER seen on any dog.

Zim

Yes. Breaksticks are prudent. Not because of locking jaws. Because of their temperment. They come down from butcher's dogs, dogs who were bred to herd raging bulls by gripping and holding on. Which is a temperment thing. They crossed those dogs with an "english white terrier"(according to MOST historical accounts) who were bred to the tunnels and the rat pits. Two kinds of dogs whose prized trait is "game"...which in a sense is a slangy way of saying "stubborn " . Once they get amped..they go Go GO GOGOGO...this can be a happy goofy amped or a serious amped. Its a trait independant of what you might term "intent"(to anthropomorphize a bit)

To be continued...

fawkese1

so is it not possible that through selective breeding they are more dog aggressive...(i'm not disagreeing, just trying to make sure i understand) i mean...aren't some temperament traits breed specific? so couldn't it be that dog aggression is...great pyranees and other flock guardians tend to not like strange dogs...which makes sense...


the break stick thing...why would you not need it for other terrier breeds? does grabbing the back legs and dragging in a circle not work for pits? i read the snap snap snap/ bite hold thing too...makes some sense, but seems odd that such a small population of dogs would have that trait in comparison to all the other breeds/ breed types out there if that makes sense....

fawkese1

sorry zim...i was writing my post when you posted yours...i'd heard the bull thing...bull baiting used to be done for sport too...

again that makes sense, but would that make it true for all the bully breeds...

pits always seem sort of intense to me...is that what you mean? like when they play...they really really play....hard....

Criosphynx

my understanding is the back leg trick will work if you can sufficiently surprise the dog... at least thats what I see people saying.

the dog that grabbed Emma would not let go for me and let go when the owner grabbed her from behind...startling her so it worked in my case

Mikey

I watch pitt's closer (all pitt-type dogs-and ANY large large dog who is not a herding or hound type breed) at the dog park-not because they are more aggressive then others (They could be-but I don't know them) but because these kind of dogs can cause more damage.....

AND because I'm a little weary of the KIND OF PERSON who would seek them out (They are restricted here) and pay extra licensing a year AND completely forsake the fact that the law here states that they have to have a muzzle on.

I just think-no matter the breed, if I wasn't allowed one, I wouldn't get it. Not to mention the kind of person (NOT always but often-I can describe the type-young 20-35 male, I won't go on...) who WANT a dog who looks scary to others...They sought out a pitt because they LIKE people to be scared of their dog.

(I understand it's not always the case-but from what I see it's quite often-here anyways..)

For me my prejudice is not to the dog, but to the type of person who WANTS one (buys it purebred) and totally ignores the muzzle law...

fawkese1

oh yeah...there are lots of 20 somethings who've never had a dog in their entire lives who go out and get pits...so that they can look cool, lots...that i think is part of the problem with the image that pits have...i've also seen little old ladies in my area with them...seriously...and there are lots of families that have them...you just don't see them out making such a big deal about it....at least not here...
so pits are maybe harder to startle...especially when in the fight/flight mode...that does make sense...like you said they have a longer fuse....or most tend too...would you also say that they tend more toward fight then flight when it actually comes down to it? i know that a dog will do what works and stuff, but some breeds, i think tend more toward one or the other first....

Criosphynx

my dog chooses flight, if flight does not work, she shutsdown..

but yes I agree...what they default to first is likely genetic...

Critter/Chili goes from flight to fight FAST.

Tippy/Emma/Kiwi will flight then shut down, at varying degrees of aversives.

Kiwi was attacked TWICE by stray dogs...she did nothing but lay there and perhaps half heartedly flee.

my pit has a abnormal temperament tho..."cold" temperament IMO.



Mikey, they are really really common here in CA...so its more of a "everyone has one so I should too" ...like to fit in, rather than be tough.